Some common sense at last

[Insel affe]

It was in the clothing industry/retail. I had a brown coat which was that shade.

I recall my gran getting some wool and she called it that back in the late 70s, I thought it was just her attitude and was not aware it was actually called N---er Brown, surely it was a derogatory meaning. Shocking to be honest.

 

[RedRob]

It certainly was, but more 30s and 40s rather than 70s. How do you think Guy Gibson's dog got his name?

...My Mum once told me(actually, it was more than once....it always is at least 'twice' with everything ) that you could once buy '****** brown' cotton from sewing shops. Have a feeling that would be 50s/60s...(?)

 

[dazzer6666]

http://www.kasush.co.uk/low-price-abercrombie-men-long-tees-******-brown-afhco11900.html

How about 2014 ?

 

[soistes]

I don't know what you mean by "in my day", but I am 61 and well remember collecting Golliwog badges and so on, and not as a child associating golliwogs with anything racist.

But then you realise that Enid Blyton wrote in her Noddy books about where the golliwogs live being a dangerous and nasty place, and she meant it, I believe, as racist.

I'm 59 and likewise I remember gollywogs etc being ok when I was a kid.

I now understand more about racism, and realise that it's not ok.

I was brought up, like many white Brits of my age, in a (just) post-imperialist society, in which casual racism was the norm. That doesn't make me a bad person (I hope), but now I can see the other side of it, I wouldn't dream about going on about "political correctness gone mad" etc

If political correctness means being careful about the impact that things we say and do might have on other people from a different background, then it sounds to me like a good thing, and we could probably do with more of it.

 

[pastafarian]

i quite enjoyed getting caned

fagging was a pain in the arse though.

 

[Hastings gull]

I think you've done a relatively good job of showing how people that normally moan about the world being "too PC" just don't like the fact they can't say racist things anymore without being called a racist.

This is far too simplistic in my humble opinion. 40 years ago attitudes were very different and references to golliwogs etc were not intended to offend. Now it is different -black people have said that they are offended at this and I imagine that most of us would, therefore, refrain from using the words. At school in the 60s, my best mate was from East Africa- can't quite remember where -and his nickname was "inky". Everyone used it, it was an accepted term of endearment, and no one thought anything of it, certainly not inky himself. It just didn't occur to anyone that it was offensive at the time. So, it would follow that if you have that experience behind you, you are likely to view PC issues with rather more scepticism, because you can recall a time when attitudes were different. Of course that is no excuse for racial abuse nowadays, but it doesn't mean what you are inferring.

 

[Dan Aitch]

I remember the good old days at the Goldstone when Boney M's 'Brown Girl In The Ring' was plagiarised and changed to 'Black Bitch On The Pitch'. The good old days, eh? Let's get back to those traditional values and make sure people know that such banter is good hearted, entirely warranted, completely in line with 21st Century values and that if they don't like it they'd better not call me racist for learning nothing about equality, diversity and inclusion during my sad, bigoted, narrow-minded and inflexible ways. After all, that's just political correctness gone mad. The problem isn't mine - it's everybody else's, especially the ones who look different and won't accept that they're less deserving of, well, anything at all.

And as for women's football... all those tampons make me feel sick. Get back to the kitchen.

 

[Insel affe]

I remember the good old days at the Goldstone when Boney M's 'Brown Girl In The Ring' was plagiarised and changed to 'Black Bitch On The Pitch'. The good old days, eh? Let's get back to those traditional values and make sure people know that such banter is good hearted, entirely warranted, completely in line with 21st Century values and that if they don't like it they'd better not call me racist for learning nothing about equality, diversity and inclusion during my sad, bigoted, narrow-minded and inflexible ways. After all, that's just political correctness gone mad. The problem isn't mine - it's everybody else's, especially the ones who look different and won't accept that they're less deserving of, well, anything at all.

And as for women's football... all those tampons make me feel sick. Get back to the kitchen.

...

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

No, was (supposedly) Ok in the 70s but not now.

Fair enough.

 

[Brovion]

M

Urmmm im not a 100% certain that N---er brown was a proper colour, I don't remember seeing it in the deluxe colour chart or it being an option in the Ford Capri back in the good old three day weeks in the 70s....
.

Yes it was. Wool was sold as 'N...r Brown'. It was an official description. There was also an organisation called The Spastics' Society, another word that used to be acceptable. Language changes, attitudes change. Which is fine. The only time I have a problem is when someone tries to retrospectively apply current mores. The bowlderised version of The Dambusters film really gets my goat, although the last few times I've seen it the 'N' word has thankfully been re-instated.

EDIT: Ah, if I'd read to the end of the thread I'd have seen that you were aware of the wool example. Shame on you thinking your gran was a racist! (Although if she was she was only a child of her time. My Dad was a dreadful racist).

 

[Mo Gosfield]

M

Urmmm im not a 100% certain that N---er brown was a proper colour, I don't remember seeing it in the deluxe colour chart or it being an option in the Ford Capri back in the good old three day weeks in the 70s....

Oh and you do know playing the White Man emplies that your playing fair and any other race is cheating or not to be trusted right ! You better had not knowen that actually otherwise your comments make you out to be a moron.

The Concise Oxford Dictionary ( 1976 )....' n-g-er brown '...." dark shade of brown "
....and thank you for those kind words that follow...I shall treasure them.

 

[knocky1]

Yes it was. Wool was sold as 'N...r Brown'. It was an official description. There was also an organisation called The Spastics' Society, another word that used to be acceptable. Language changes, attitudes change. Which is fine. The only time I have a problem is when someone tries to retrospectively apply current mores. The bowlderised version of The Dambusters film really gets my goat, although the last few times I've seen it the 'N' word has thankfully been re-instated.

EDIT: Ah, if I'd read to the end of the thread I'd have seen that you were aware of the wool example. Shame on you thinking your gran was a racist! (Although if she was she was only a child of her time. My Dad was a dreadful racist).

Aaah the sentimental types missing the days when they could have a spastic golliwog knitted from ****** wool. Ssoon someone will be recounting stories of African gentleman unhappy that they cannot buy such products to take back home due to the pc brigade.

 

[Insel affe]

Shame on you thinking your gran was a racist! (Although if she was she was only a child of her time. My Dad was a dreadful racist).

Hi fella, I loved my gran dearly as I lived with her from a the age of three for several years until she became too ill to look after me. She was brought up in Burma as her family ran the forestry commission near Rangoon, where she met my Grandad who was a Priest trying to convert the locals etc. So I understand her background very well as she had servants & staff in Rangoon who helped bring her up in fact and she spoke with great affection about them, however she did call them names you would not dare in this day and age, I can see it had an effect on my father and his attitude aswell as my own when I was younger. However you learn that some of these words and ideas have sinister overtones and it is not correct. I am sure if my Gran was still alive she would see that they were wrong, but she was a person of her time and social surroundings, conditioned if you will.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[spring hall convert]

It was a relative of mine that made the effigy so I've been pretty close to this all along. Extremely glad sense has prevailed here.

I suspect the extra attention means that people will be sniffing around next year's event looking for a controversy.

 

[Brovion]

Hi fella, I loved my gran dearly as I lived with her from a the age of three for several years until she became too ill to look after me. She was brought up in Burma as her family ran the forestry commission near Rangoon, where she met my Grandad who was a Priest trying to convert the locals etc. So I understand her background very well as she had servants & staff in Rangoon who helped bring her up in fact and she spoke with great affection about them, however she did call them names you would not dare in this day and age, I can see it had an effect on my father and his attitude aswell as my own when I was younger. However you learn that some of these words and ideas have sinister overtones and it is not correct. I am sure if my Gran was still alive she would see that they were wrong, but she was a person of her time and social surroundings, conditioned if you will.

Hope that makes sense.

Makes perfect sense, like I said she was a child of her time. As are we!

 

[Wellesley]

I had a golliwog when I was a kid, but it didn't do any cooking or even any cleaning, so I got rid of it.

 

[GOM]

Stephen Fry would probably say that there is "offended" and "offended". I remember his episode of "Who do you think you are", where he discovered that members of his family had been removed from Vienna to concentration camps.

And if he doesn't think there is "offended" and "offended", my opinion of him has just plummeted..... or I would like to hear his rationale.

I don't think you get 'offended' by your relations being removed from Vienna to concentration camps, I think the emotions would be somewhat stronger, perhaps outrage or many more, but not 'offended'.

 

[GOM]

I got caned 4 times I agree it bloody hurt , doesn't mean I agree with it , I certainly couldn't imagine being very happy for my 13 year old to come home with the red weals that turn to bruises after being caned.

If I came home with red weals that turn to bruises after being caned, my father would have been more concerned with what I had done to deserve it. Times have changed.

 

[User removed 4]

If I came home with red weals that turn to bruises after being caned, my father would have been more concerned with what I had done to deserve it. Times have changed.

Then your father would've needed to get his priorities right , I believe in strong discipline , my son goes to a secondary school that provides this , discipline is very strictly enforced, the kids in the vast majority are polite , well behaved, wear their uniform smartly and achieve high academic standards , all without the need for some quite possibly perverted teacher meting out extremely painful physical punishment that is so extreme that it leaves bruises.

 

[Hastings gull]

If I came home with red weals that turn to bruises after being caned, my father would have been more concerned with what I had done to deserve it. Times have changed.

Yes, yet another example of how times have changed and that attitudes are different. Obviously can't speak for all, but in experience albeit, most people of the older generation would say, rightly or wrongly, that getting the cane did not do them any harm in the long run.
I came home from school in the 60s, with a letter saying that I had received the cane for some heinous crime, and knew then that my parents were of the mind, that if you got hit at school, you got hit at home as well. My mum was sitting in the kitchen having a cuppa with the neighbour, and I thought that with someone else there, she would not dare, so blurted it out to get in quickly! No such luck! She was furious and struck out, but like any self-respecting teenager, I ducked, and she caught the neighbour a beauty!