So, over 700 dead......

[jimhigham]

I'm not religious by any stretch but I think that is wrong, without religion there would be no conformity, without conformity rules are impossible to enforce so it would be survival of the fittest. And that is the beginning of the end of civilisation as we know it.

Ever been to Japan? A model of conformity in a land not exactly beset by religion.

 

[ThePompousPaladin]

It’s not anti-Islam, it's an anti-God vibe. Never before in our history have we witnessed world events like we are seeing today so it is not surprising there is heightened disillusionment with the whole religious agenda

I understand your sentiment, however i think you might be seeing acts from fundamentalist religions/religious people and attributing them to *all* religions/religious people.

To me, speaking as a christian, the enemy is extreme religions and the dogmatic thought they promote. This in my opinion and experience can only be countered with moderate religion.

Whether god exists or not, many are always going to have a spiritual aspect to their nature.

 

[Juan Albion]

Ever been to Japan? A model of conformity in a land not exactly beset by religion.

Oh dear.

 

[matthew]

Has to test people's belief if loved ones are lost doing this sacred pilgrimage

 

[Sam Ovett]

was it at the bit where they throw stones because learning about that at school with pictures in the revision guides always made it look pretty dangerous.

 

[Wilko]

Oddly after years of hating religion i never felt closer after the terrible shorham accident and hoped that everyone involved would be cared for and looked after. I guess in hard times you hope there is a higher power.

Cared and looked after by the same god (refuse to use a capital) that would have caused the tragedy in the first place? As you say, it is all utter nonsense.

 

[scousefan]

3 million people all trying to follow the same route at the same time. Add to that different groups who can't communicate and a tradition that is hard to change. It's a recipe for disaster and time and again it happens. I feel slightly sorry fur the Saudi's. Unlike some have said on here, if the same event happened in Europe it would be just as hazardous. The Saudis are the keepers of Mecca. Tradition is very important there and it would be hard to change the traditional route and customs in any way.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

so nothing matters; **** it, do what you want, maniplulate the vulnerable, you mean

Sorry but I don't see what you're getting at.

I didn't say or intend to imply that nothing matters.

 

[Surrey_Albion]

Of course they do. But it was religion that gave us the fundamental first 10 commandments. To me they're common sense albeit with a religious start point.Which even though I'm not religious are a good set of principles to live by and which I try to live my life by. If we hadn't of started with those 10 how much of a cluster**** would the world be now? Nearly all of the things that make the news are a direct result of not obeying them. There would be no sense of morality or balance to judge things if they didn't exist in the first place.

but it hasn't worked hence "killing in HIS name" and all the extremists

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

This is not an ignorant view.

When asked about Iraq; Blair has said that “God will judge him”. He is not interested in the Hague judging him whilst he is alive. Therefore he has absolved himself from personal responsibility and any conscience whilst he is living. If he needs God to remind him of the hell and devastation he facilitated in Iraq we have a massive problem.

I take your point....... But there is the possibility that he might be worried that God will judge him.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Is a Tsunami or earthquake anything to do with free will?......the bloke(or woman) who created tectonic plates has much to answer for

Of course not. Sh1t happens, some of it is man-made, some of it is natural. This is not a perfect world.

 

[Surrey_Albion]

Atheism hasn't been around long enough to be considered to be a reasonable alternative to the Abrahamic religions. Besides, none of us know whether God exists or not, we can only have faith in our beliefs.

The only real solution to these problems is to create a tolerant, secular world where all faiths are respected and can be practised safely.

This is a terrible tragedy in a country with little respect for human life - suffice to say, it wouldn't happen in Europe.

I agree education and therefore tolerance is the answer . ad for god's existence thanks to educated people being able to see planets light years away and a HUGE lack of any evidence of God's existence the more educated and open to ideas the better as people will stop beleiving

 

[rogersix]

A God who allows free will, does not predestine everything and is horrified at some of the things we get up to - including some of the things done in his name - or her name.

what would the remit be of the god you describe? he only allows "good" things to happen; like a highly stratified money producing organisation, infanticide, etc, etc

 

[pastafarian]

Of course they do. But it was religion that gave us the fundamental first 10 commandments. To me they're common sense albeit with a religious start point.Which even though I'm not religious are a good set of principles to live by and which I try to live my life by. If we hadn't of started with those 10 how much of a cluster**** would the world be now? Nearly all of the things that make the news are a direct result of not obeying them. There would be no sense of morality or balance to judge things if they didn't exist in the first place.

a good set of principles to live by?

 

[Lethargic]

3 million people all trying to follow the same route at the same time. Add to that different groups who can't communicate and a tradition that is hard to change. It's a recipe for disaster and time and again it happens. I feel slightly sorry fur the Saudi's. Unlike some have said on here, if the same event happened in Europe it would be just as hazardous. The Saudis are the keepers of Mecca. Tradition is very important there and it would be hard to change the traditional route and customs in any way.

Unfortunately that is not the case though as these event happen on an increased regularity the Saudis are pumping money into Mecca to expand the size of the city with highways, hotels and other infrastructure to support ever increasing numbers. This will get worse before it gets better (if) so the Saudis can have the controlling influence over Muslims.

 

[Nibble]

Ever been to Japan? A model of conformity in a land not exactly beset by religion.

Although they do believe their emperor to be a living God. Sad fact is that people do conform to religion in many forms, let's hope we all evolve past this nonsense at some point.

 

[wellquickwoody]

Reassuringly the Beeb have just said that it is the highest death toll for 25 years, and that King Soandso has launched an inquiry.

Well that will make everything better, lucky that 25 years have elapsed since the death toll was higher, no need to worry about 300 odd six years ago, or 600 odd fifteen years ago then (these figures are a representation of reality, not gods honest factual truth). #medieval

 

[Insel affe]

Unfortunately that is not the case though as these event happen on an increased regularity the Saudis are pumping money into Mecca to expand the size of the city with highways, hotels and other infrastructure to support ever increasing numbers. This will get worse before it gets better (if) so the Saudis can have the controlling influence over Muslims.

Are you daring to suggest that some rich and influential people are aiming to make money off the back of this so called religion ?

hmmm... so it is in their interest to say perhaps that instead of "What a terrible accident" and possibly be culpable in some indirect way, they could say "It is Gods will" and therefore absolve themselves of any blame....

hmmm.... interesting.....

Disclaimer: my opinions are based on mistrust of all religions.... divide and rule my friends.... divide and rule.

 

[Nibble]

Humans tell stories. That is what we've done for millennia. From exaggerating the tales of a bison hunt around the campfire, through wondering minstrels to tales we tell our children to help them sleep at night. They serve a very valuable purpose that eases our path through life. Religion is one of these stories that facilitates our way in the world. Unfortunately it also facilitates greed and the desire to dominate the populous. Should one choose to believe these stories, well, as long as you don't harm others, crack on. There's a big difference between attending a parish church and baking buns for the fete and beheading people who don't flow the same story. It is of course, ALL utter Horsefeathers.

 

[narly101]

I think Stephen Fry sums up perfectly "God" in all his guises here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-suvkwNYSQo