[News] Should we Bring Back National Service? Sunak says YES.

[Pevenseagull]

Many boomers often act like they won the war and have views that I don’t blame them for. They were also products of the environment they grew up in I guess. My old man was born in 1945. So played no part in the war and very little in rebuilding the country. But somehow acts like he won the thing. I love him dearly and he did serve for ages in the military but let’s not pretend hey pop!

Difficult to stop old boys from back in the day bragging about all the flights they got involved in during the 1960's and the birds that they gave a punch up the whiskers.


Not your father


Just lots of them that I know

 

[Gwylan]

Namby pamby goes back to 1725, so it doesn’t just refer to modern day society.

"All ye Poets of the Age!
All ye Witlings of the Stage!
Learn your Jingles to reform!Crop your Numbers and Conform:
Let your little Verses flowGently, Sweetly, Row by Row:
Let the Verse the Subject fit;
Little Subject, Little Wit.Namby-Pamby is your Guide;
Albion's Joy, Hibernia's Pride

[A pedant writes]Namby Pamby was the nickname of a poet called Ambrose Philips (referred to in this verse). It was only later that it came to mean weak.

Re National Service. I know that my father hated it and father-in-law doesn't speak too fondly of it. You'd have to be at least 82 to have done National Service, so those 60+ who are in favour won't have done it themselves. People like my late dad are the ones who know - and theyre no longer with us

 

[London Irish]

At this stage, you'd be investigating the Tories for betting scams, not that West Ham bloke

 

[Zeberdi]

More details

National service explained: Rishi Sunak unveils Conservative election plan

The government has confirmed no one will be forced to do military training under the £2.5bn scheme.

www.bbc.co.uk

Rishi Sunak’s national service pledge is ‘bonkers’, says ex-military chief

Criticism of proposed scheme comes as another blow to the party’s struggling election campaign

www.theguardian.com

From the right wing Telegraph

Esther Ranzten

“I certainly think that volunteering has an awful lot to offer young people and young people have an awful lot to offer volunteering. And it is not just young people – how about a bit of compulsory volunteering for the over 65s in return for the triple lock pensions?”

National Service return could boost Britain’s resilience, says retired RAF officer

Air Marshal Edward Stringer says other countries have already provided a ‘model’ for how the Government could make it a success

www.telegraph.co.uk

Most objections since Sunak made his announcement seem to be on the grounds that the ‘policy’ is un-costed, ill thought out and lacks substance but in principle, according to the RIGHT WING Onward research conducted in August 2023, the majority of the public back the idea of some form of voluntary national/community civic service.

Great British National Service

Great British National Service: How national service could develop skills, improve mental wellbeing, and increase a sense of belonging among Britain's youth

www.ukonward.com

 

[Uh_huh_him]

Why are people against it ? Would give some little scumbags on our streets a kick up the arse and discipline. I don’t care that it’s the tories who have said it, it works in other countries. I’m fed up with this namby pamby society these days. You wouldn’t have to go to war.

Because it only appeals to people who think that all 18 year olds are scumbags causing trouble on the street.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

 

[Uh_huh_him]

Whole heartedly agree. Boomers (sadly I am one) and whatever came after that, are a really needy bunch. They are offended by everything and think they are the hardest done by generation. Wankers.

yup.

as @Berty23 pointed out.
The "I worked hard for everything I've got" sanctimonious attitude, is very galling.

Many of us growing up in the 70s/80s Britain has had massive advantages of low taxation, low house prices, low inflation, low interest rates, no university fees.

All of these factors provided my generation with opportunities which simply don't exist for many young people today.

I worked in an industry where overtime was plentiful and well rewarded. Sure I worked hard, but a lot of it was on time and a half and double time!

My Daughter recently applied for a part time waitressing job, where she was told, she would be expected to work 4 x 13 hr shifts a weak during peak periods, at less than minimum wage, because of tips.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Why are people against it ? Would give some little scumbags on our streets a kick up the arse and discipline. I don’t care that it’s the tories who have said it, it works in other countries. I’m fed up with this namby pamby society these days. You wouldn’t have to go to war.

You can’t take something like this in isolation. If your point is ‘a kick up the arse for some little scumbags’ then you have to get in there BEFORE they are 18.

We’ve had over a decade of real cuts to school budgets, what they can offer outside of school day hours, youth services, provision for youth clubs, help and training.

Post 18 year old education and training is expensive. You’d be better off setting up academies to gain Microsoft certifications, basic project management skills that could be applied from trades to professional services.

This is purely a policy to get old grumpy people nodding sagely that’s what the youth of today need, all the while actually being too young to have done any national service themselves.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

yup.

as @Berty23

My Daughter recently applied for a part time waitressing job, where she was told, she would be expected to work 4 x 13 hr shifts a weak during peak periods, at less than minimum wage, because of tips.

Just to point out - it is illegal for an employer in the UK to count tips towards the minimum wage.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

Just to point out - it is illegal for an employer in the UK to count tips towards the minimum wage.

interesting - She didn't get the job anyway.
Sounds like that restaurant are scamming their employees and their customers then.

 

[B-right-on]

My

yup.

as @Berty23 pointed out.
The "I worked hard for everything I've got" sanctimonious attitude, is very galling.

Many of us growing up in the 70s/80s Britain has had massive advantages of low taxation, low house prices, low inflation, low interest rates, no university fees.

All of these factors provided my generation with opportunities which simply don't exist for many young people today.

I worked in an industry where overtime was plentiful and well rewarded. Sure I worked hard, but a lot of it was on time and a half and double time!

My Daughter recently applied for a part time waitressing job, where she was told, she would be expected to work 4 x 13 hr shifts a weak during peak periods, at less than minimum wage, because of tips.

The Mrs worked for EDF for 15 years as a phone operator in Portland Rd. She left about 8-9 years ago. Recently she was looking at job sites and saw an advert for the same job on FAR less money than when she left them, and it wasn't that good then. No way is this a survivable wage in this day and age.

 

[Comrade Sam]

Can we send the cabinet to the front in the Ukraine?

 

[surlyseagull]

Perhaps allowing kids at 16 to leave school /education if they wanted to pursue a needed career path for needed proffesions instead of making them stay till 18 against their will because they havent passed maths or English by a couple of points and probably never will ,may be a start instead of national service

 

[dippy2449]

More details

National service explained: Rishi Sunak unveils Conservative election plan

The government has confirmed no one will be forced to do military training under the £2.5bn scheme.

www.bbc.co.uk

Rishi Sunak’s national service pledge is ‘bonkers’, says ex-military chief

Criticism of proposed scheme comes as another blow to the party’s struggling election campaign

www.theguardian.com

From the right wing Telegraph

Esther Ranzten

“I certainly think that volunteering has an awful lot to offer young people and young people have an awful lot to offer volunteering. And it is not just young people – how about a bit of compulsory volunteering for the over 65s in return for the triple lock pensions?”

National Service return could boost Britain’s resilience, says retired RAF officer

Air Marshal Edward Stringer says other countries have already provided a ‘model’ for how the Government could make it a success

www.telegraph.co.uk

Most objections since Sunak made his announcement seem to be on the grounds that the ‘policy’ is un-costed, ill thought out and lacks substance but in principle, according to the RIGHT WING Onward research conducted in August 2023, the majority of the public back the idea of some form of voluntary national/community civic service.

Great British National Service

Great British National Service: How national service could develop skills, improve mental wellbeing, and increase a sense of belonging among Britain's youth

www.ukonward.com

One volunteer is better than ten pressed men

 

[Guinness Boy]

 

[dippy2449]

yup.

as @Berty23 pointed out.
The "I worked hard for everything I've got" sanctimonious attitude, is very galling.

Many of us growing up in the 70s/80s Britain has had massive advantages of low taxation, low house prices, low inflation, low interest rates, no university fees.

All of these factors provided my generation with opportunities which simply don't exist for many young people today.

I worked in an industry where overtime was plentiful and well rewarded. Sure I worked hard, but a lot of it was on time and a half and double time!

My Daughter recently applied for a part time waitressing job, where she was told, she would be expected to work 4 x 13 hr shifts a weak during peak periods, at less than minimum wage, because of tips.

In the 1970's and 80's Unions held a lot of power. Now Unions are toothless and mostly in the pockets of the big corporations
Strikes are more about political point scoring than fighting for the minimum wage earners

 

[A1X]

Most objections since Sunak made his announcement seem to be on the grounds that the ‘policy’ is un-costed, ill thought out and lacks substance but in principle, according to the RIGHT WING Onward research conducted in August 2023, the majority of the public back the idea of some form of voluntary national/community civic service.

Great British National Service

Great British National Service: How national service could develop skills, improve mental wellbeing, and increase a sense of belonging among Britain's youth

www.ukonward.com

 

[A1X]

 

[B-right-on]

Very dangerous slippery slope.

Look at what started as the EEA and ended up as what we've got.

This alone is enough to put me off voting Tory. I was a fence before. Only because I didn't like the other options.

Look at the USA. No they don't have compulsory conscription but things are so heavily weighted towards vets that it a 'thing to do'.

The United States Spends More on Defense than the Next 9 Countries Combined. Defense spending by the United States accounted for nearly 40 percent of military expenditures by countries around the world in 2023.

And they started more wars and invaded more countries than anyone else in recent history.

If we have a large military, it'll be used by politicians for their own ends. 100% certain of it.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

In the 1970's and 80's Unions held a lot of power. Now Unions are toothless and mostly in the pockets of the big corporations
Strikes are more about political point scoring than fighting for the minimum wage earners

We were all taught that the unions were holding us all back and only out for themselves.
We collectively agreed we didn't want any more of that and gave away our bargaining positions, so we would collectively benefit from the prosperity which would undoubtedly ensue.
It worked for a bit, too.

But now we are stuck with higher prices and lower wages and pointing angrily at train drivers who have the gall to earn a decent wage.