Cheeky Monkey
Well-known member
- Jul 17, 2003
- 23,884
of 120,000 who flew in night time bombing raids over Germany 50,000 were killed - a quite staggering percentage and sacrifice!
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Remembrance Sunday
- Thread starter eastlondonseagull
- Start date
Keeping The Dream Alive.
Naming Rights
The difference between then and now is just phenomenal. You'd never see a reaction from everyday civillians in this day like you did then. Unbelievable. The amount of students my age that show no respect whatsoever to those that served for this country makes me sick.
defrocked priest
Father Footy
Remembrance Day is the only ceremony I acknowledge. 
clapham_gull
Legacy Fan
- Aug 20, 2003
- 25,885
Well I can understand that as the day is often misrepresented in the minds of many as a celebration of the military. I'm not sure it is supposed to be about patriotism or serving your country.
I've always seen it is as a very very sad day, there to remind us (and governents) that there is a human cost to war.
Lord Bracknell
On fire
I guess the meaning of Remembrance Day changes over time.
As I've posted here before ... as a child, I don't recall the members of my family being very keen on wearing poppies, taking part in the day, or even acknowledging the minutes silence. And they were people who had been in the armed services (my father's ship was torpedoed, with significant loss of life) and had lost close friends and relatives in both WW1 and WW2 and (on my mother's side) spent much of WW2 living in an area that was under frequent and regular bombing.
I think it was the militarism of the day and the role given to the Establishment that they didn't much like. I suspect that some of the older members of the family nurtured a sense of bitterness about people being sent away to die pointlessly, especially in WW1.
It's a curious feature of modern British society that it's only in the last few years that the silence on 11 November itself has been revived.
But I'm not knocking anyone for whom it makes sense to "remember" things this way - even if the remembrance is second hand.
As I've posted here before ... as a child, I don't recall the members of my family being very keen on wearing poppies, taking part in the day, or even acknowledging the minutes silence. And they were people who had been in the armed services (my father's ship was torpedoed, with significant loss of life) and had lost close friends and relatives in both WW1 and WW2 and (on my mother's side) spent much of WW2 living in an area that was under frequent and regular bombing.
I think it was the militarism of the day and the role given to the Establishment that they didn't much like. I suspect that some of the older members of the family nurtured a sense of bitterness about people being sent away to die pointlessly, especially in WW1.
It's a curious feature of modern British society that it's only in the last few years that the silence on 11 November itself has been revived.
But I'm not knocking anyone for whom it makes sense to "remember" things this way - even if the remembrance is second hand.
Brian Fantana
Well-known member
I like to think of Remembrance Day as a chance to pay my respect to ALL who have died as a direct or indirect result of war. In addition it is a day to give thanks to those brave servicemen and women who fought to create the free and democratic nation that we live in today.
On a personal note, I have a great-great uncle who won a Victoria Cross in WW1. For those interested he was a 21 year old lieutenant who was commannding a small force of men on Hill 60 in Belgium, I believe. If the Germans had broken through then it would have been a great blow to the Allies. As night fell all the men but my uncle were dead and he spent the whole night going up and round the hill firing off all the guns to give the impression that it was still heavily manned. The Germans fell for it and decided to not attack till the morning by which time help had arrived.
Needless to say I am very proud of him. It must have taken some serious bollocks to not retreat.
On a personal note, I have a great-great uncle who won a Victoria Cross in WW1. For those interested he was a 21 year old lieutenant who was commannding a small force of men on Hill 60 in Belgium, I believe. If the Germans had broken through then it would have been a great blow to the Allies. As night fell all the men but my uncle were dead and he spent the whole night going up and round the hill firing off all the guns to give the impression that it was still heavily manned. The Germans fell for it and decided to not attack till the morning by which time help had arrived.
Needless to say I am very proud of him. It must have taken some serious bollocks to not retreat.
eastlondonseagull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #28
pasty
A different kind of pasty
Something I've noticed this morning, is the number of people NOT wearing their poppies anymore. Yes, Rememberance Sunday was yesterday, but I always wear mine until 11th November.
Are you still wearing yours?
Are you still wearing yours?
London Calling
New member
that fourth didn't actually see any action, he never left these shores!
Surely it should be all things to all men (and women). If you just wish to remember those that served then do so but if you wish to remember all those that have died in war then that is your right as well. My view is that is should be anyone who has died during a conflict. Soldiers fight but they can't do that without support,ie people who worked in the munition factories, the people who farmed and fed them etc etc.
Decide for yourselves and don't let others dictate to you.
Decide for yourselves and don't let others dictate to you.
London Calling
New member
Agree but the day is about everyone who sacrificed themselves: this by its nature includes service personnel, and civilians who died and contributed.
I was going to say that. In World War 1 the British introduced conscription in January 1916, so a lot of those who died had absolutely no say in the matter. Interestingly the man billed as 'the last fighting Tommy', Harry Patch, was a conscript who'd had no intention of joining up voluntarily.
My Dad, who served in the Royal Navy in WW2 (he commanded a landing craft on D-Day amongst other things) thought Rememberance Sunday was a load of bollocks. He thought it was too militaristic and as we'd fought two wars against a militaristic power he thought it was a bit rich. He recanted, slightly, in 1994 when on the 50th anniversary of D-Day he wore his medals in public for the first time. He went to church (again something he hadn't done for 50 years) and then went down the pub. When the regulars saw his medals they all insisted on buying him drinks. He was so pleased he wore his medals down the pub every Rememberance Sunday from then till he died.
Very true and given what I've said about my Dad obviously our families shared similar feelings. Also my grandfathers, both survivors of the trenches in WW1, weren't big on it either and I don't recall much fuss being made about it.
I think it's because they were civilians who were either forced into service or 'tricked' into it by the authorities playing the patriotic card, and yes, there was resentment. The only one who I remember who thought it was very important was a great-uncle who'd lost an eye serving with General Allenby and fighting the Turks in the Middle East. The difference was he was a professional soldier who'd been in the regular army before 1914.
London Calling
New member
Ms LC Great Uncle was a Vicar (Padre) in WW1. He got a George Cross for bravery etc.
What risks must he put himself through as he cared for the sick and injured and dying on the battlefield, trenches and hospitals.
According to some on here REembrance Day isn't about him, because he wasn't in the armed forces?
What risks must he put himself through as he cared for the sick and injured and dying on the battlefield, trenches and hospitals.
According to some on here REembrance Day isn't about him, because he wasn't in the armed forces?
brightonbear
New member
- Jan 2, 2008
- 130
The point in it all mate is that you are free to make your choice as to whether you wear a poppy or not, unlike the Jews who were not free to decide whether they wanted to wear a star on the their clothes, while they were in the ghetto's of Warsaw waiting to be shipped to Nazi death camps.
Lest we forget.........