So Angela Raynor has refused to sign a pledge to Leader Corbyn that Momentum ask MP’s sign if they want their support, I wonder if Peter Kyle or the Kemptown MP have signed?
I know Ernest has!
I know Ernest has!
[Politics] Pledge to Corbyn!
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pastafarian
Well-known member
Momentum really are a very troubling organisation.There supporters are quite full of hate and are full of the sort of toxic venom that Corbyn campaigns against. How on earth have they been allowed to become so powerful in the Labour movement.
Lower West Stander
Well-known member
Momentum is a vehicle for snowflake Corbynistas who have no experience of the 1970s.
Probably got posters of Joe Gormley and Hugh Scanlon on their walls without having a clue who they are or what they did to the country.
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Probably got posters of Joe Gormley and Hugh Scanlon on their walls without having a clue who they are or what they did to the country.
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cheshunt seagull
Well-known member
- Jul 5, 2003
- 2,596
I agree, there are some deeply unpleasant people in Momentum.
The Merry Prankster
Pactum serva
Really? How many meetings have you been to? I was at ours last night and don’t recognise that description but I expect you have a lot more experience than me.
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,031
its what many people inside Labour are reporting. maybe they are all just lying, including a number of MPs?
The Merry Prankster
Pactum serva
I attended the committee meeting of our local group last night. Every single person on it had lived through the seventies and none of them had any desire to revisit them.
The Merry Prankster
Pactum serva
Oh I see. You’d rather take the word of some disillusioned centrists and Blairites who are desperately trying to hang on to their power/prestige/money/jobs than actually find out for yourself. And they are lying. Barefacedly. Our meeting last night was about the need to remain open, honest and engaging in the face of this onslaught. You might not like what we say (and that’s fine) but hopefully we are honest and open about how we go about our business and how we present our ideas.
Lower West Stander
Well-known member
I don't think any one wants 3 day weeks, power cuts, governments going cap in hand to the IMF and British Leyland strikes over tea breaks.
Its the inevitability of it......
I'm no socialist, nor an apologist for the way they elect their leaders, but after the last general election campaign I will say I now have the utmost respect for the way things are being done in that party. For a start, they actually bothered costing a manifesto and campaigned positively through that manifesto. Consequently, from a terribly low starting position, they rebuilt their support base to the extent that they ate into Conservative and SNP shares of the vote.
I think it is quite sad that the Tories were able to stay in power by repeating the mantra "vote for us or you'll get that nasty Mr Corbyn". They offered nothing in the way of policies or promises, and have been able to get away with delivering absolutely nothing since then. What they have done is cling onto outright power by jeapardising the Good Friday Agreement by buying the votes of the DUP at a cost of billions to the English, Welsh and Scottish tax payers.
I'd say any right thinking Tory could do a lot worse than rethink this tiresome sneering at Jeremy Corbyn, he's got little to be ashamed of.
I think it is quite sad that the Tories were able to stay in power by repeating the mantra "vote for us or you'll get that nasty Mr Corbyn". They offered nothing in the way of policies or promises, and have been able to get away with delivering absolutely nothing since then. What they have done is cling onto outright power by jeapardising the Good Friday Agreement by buying the votes of the DUP at a cost of billions to the English, Welsh and Scottish tax payers.
I'd say any right thinking Tory could do a lot worse than rethink this tiresome sneering at Jeremy Corbyn, he's got little to be ashamed of.
No chance of the last thing happening - they went to the wall (on the Tory watch, obviously).
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,031
objection. they said is was a costed but it didn't stand up to the briefest scrutiny, and relied on borrowing hundreds of billions. though it was more costing than others, and it was a more positive manifesto/campaign. any party will do well saying they'll do everything for everyone and no one will pay for it (subject to terms and conditions, future payments may be required).
Yes, we all know how sophisticated and knowledgeable Americans are when it comes to politics. This one even appears stupid enough to have confused Corbyn with Trump.
You may or may not be right about that - it's arguable. But at least they gave the voters a chance to assess what they offered. Costings ought to be at the heart of the manifesto for any political party. It's shameful that the Conservatives didn't bother, relied on scaremongering and then got into bed with one of the sectarian parties in NI in order to preserve their grip on power.
The one thing I find baffling about Momentum is their seeming determination to spend more time fighting MPs on their own side (Hilary Benn, Peter Kyle, Jess Phillips) than any of their actual political opponents. I think it's great if younger people are actually engaging in politics but it strikes me there's this desperation for purity over pragmatism.
The Merry Prankster
Pactum serva
I think you'll find that it is the above named who are out of sync with the rest of us. At a national level the Labour Party splits into two camps 1) those that believe that a Neo-liberal economic system is bad/has run its course and those 2) who don't. Group 1 includes the leadership, the membership and Momentum, Group 2 contains some of the PLP, Blairites and centerists..
Group 1 believes its broken and needs radical fixing, Group 2 think all will be well with some edge tinkering.
They are going to disagree. One side will come out on top as there is no compromise between these two positions. Personally I hope its group 1 and they get to offer an alternative to the disaster we've got now.
jakarta
Well-known member
Group 2 includes the majority of the MPs if I remember my history regarding a Vote of No Confidence! Even if Labour get in I don't quite understand how the Dear Leader is going to dismantle the 'Neo Liberal economic system' seeing as the rest of the world (maybe China excepted) uses it?
The Merry Prankster
Pactum serva
By moving away fro the market as living God ideas of the last 30 years. If you are serious in wanting to know more about this stuff the Jeremy Gilbert is a good place to start.
David Harvey argues that China is as Neo liberal as they come.
Lower West Stander
Well-known member
That has to be one of the biggest piles of rubbish I have ever read on NSC.
Are you seriously saying that the Labour Party properly costed their manifesto?
John McDonnell has never once provided any tangible basis of calculation and has always dismissed it as a trite question and one for number crunchers. Oh and perhaps Diane Abbott can do sums after all?
Look I understand Corbyn's populist appeal to some, I really do and there is no doubt the Tories have screwed up in many many ways - but to use this argument as a basis for their suitability for government is absolute nonsense.
No, I'm saying they costed it, and you as a voter were given the opportunity of whether or not to vote for them based on that.
Did you vote for the the "vote for us or you'll get that nasty Jeremy Corbyn" party? Absolute bunch of chancers.