Nelson and his Column

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

For me the most disgusting statue in London (apart from the one of the LIFFE trader complete with housebrick mobile phone in Cannon Street, obviously) is that of Bomber Harris, unveiled in front of a London church by the Queen Mother in 1992. Sake!

 

[PTC Gull]

Communist Rules for Revolution

In May 1919 at Dusseldorf, Germany, the allied forces discovered a copy of these ‘Rules.’ They were first printed in the United States in the ‘Bartlesville (Oklahoma) Examiner-Enterprise’ the same year, 1919.

1. Corrupt the young, get them away from religion. Get them interested in sex. Make them superficial. Destroy their ruggedness.

2. Get control of all means of publicity.

3. Get people’s minds off their government by focusing their attention on athletics, sexy books and other trivialities.

4. Divide the people into hostile groups by constantly harping on controversial matters of no importance.

5. Destroy the people’s faith in their natural leaders by holding the latter up to contempt, ridicule and obloquy.

6. Always preach true democracy, but seize power as fast and as ruthlessly as possible.

7. By encouraging government extravagance, destroy its credit and produce fear of inflation with rising prices and general discontent.

8. Foment unnecessary strikes in vital industries, encourage civil disorders, and foster a lenient and soft attitude on the part of government toward such disorders.

9. By specious argument cause the breakdown of the old moral virtues, honesty, sobriety, continence, faith in the pledged word, ruggedness.

10. Cause the registration of all firearms on some pretext, with a view to confiscating them and leaving the populace helpless.

Apparently this has been researched and the computer says "no"

http://www.snopes.com/history/document/communistrules.asp

 

[Perfidious Albion]

It occurred to me that someone might just be yanking our chain by writing such a suggestion about a National hero. The Guardian's gets a lot of sales and net 'hits' , the journo. Makes a name for herself, the nation feels a wave of righteous indignation - everyone's a winner!
The fact that it is utter tosh is irrelevant.

 

[carlzeiss]

It occurred to me that someone might just be yanking our chain by writing such a suggestion about a National hero. The Guardian's gets a lot of sales and net 'hits' , the journo. Makes a name for herself, the nation feels a wave of righteous indignation - everyone's a winner!
The fact that it is utter tosh is irrelevant.

Also deemed worthy of 8mins of Chanel 4 news time yesterday :-

https://www.channel4.com/news/shoul...orn-down-afua-hirsch-and-laura-perrins-debate

 

[Lower West Stander]

There are 5 people who think it should be torn down?

 

[oneillco]

Get a grip people....there is no serious suggestion that Nelson's Column is going to be pulled down. This was one person's controversial opinion piece that has of course been seized-on as an actual proposition by The Mail and Express, etc. She could write an article saying that in her opinion Buckingham Palace should be turned into a homeless shelter, but of course that it isn't actually going to happen.

So, in summary I refuse to complete the poll because there is no serious proposal to pull Nelson's Column down.

 

[Buzzer]

Get a grip people....there is no serious suggestion that Nelson's Column is going to be pulled down. This was one person's controversial opinion piece that has of course been seized-on as an actual proposition by The Mail and Express, etc. She could write an article saying that in her opinion Buckingham Palace should be turned into a homeless shelter, but of course that it isn't actually going to happen.

So, in summary I refuse to complete the poll because there is no serious proposal to pull Nelson's Column down.

I do wish the Left would own their own f**k ups. Don't forget the rule kids - if you want to deflect then mention the Daily Mail. Works 100% of the time. This originated in the urban SJW's newspaper of choice. This columnist was paid to virtue-signal. She probably is feeling quite pleased with herself and can't wait to spout some new controversy for which she will also get handsomely paid. Whilst of course no-one is entertaining the idea at all, it still doesn't excuse the fact that the Guardian ran with this egotistical nonsense and showed this class of political activism for what it is - self-indulgent, badly thought-out, hyperbolic nonsense.

It also shows the priorities for these SJWs as I've previously alluded to. Of course Nelson's Column won't get pulled down - that's not what irritates people. It's that the people who come up with this buffoonery are given column inches in the first place. It's not just a waste of time, it's counter-productive. You know that as well as I do. So please, save your ire this time for the Guardian where it rightfully belongs and desist from the knee-jerk reaction of blaming the Daily Mail.

 

[carlzeiss]

I do wish the Left would own their own f**k ups. Don't forget the rule kids - if you want to deflect then mention the Daily Mail. Works 100% of the time. This originated in the urban SJW's newspaper of choice. This columnist was paid to virtue-signal. She probably is feeling quite pleased with herself and can't wait to spout some new controversy for which she will also get handsomely paid. Whilst of course no-one is entertaining the idea at all, it still doesn't excuse the fact that the Guardian ran with this egotistical nonsense and showed this class of political activism for what it is - self-indulgent, badly thought-out, hyperbolic nonsense.

It also shows the priorities for these SJWs as I've previously alluded to. Of course Nelson's Column won't get pulled down - that's not what irritates people. It's that the people who come up with this buffoonery are given column inches in the first place. It's not just a waste of time, it's counter-productive. You know that as well as I do. So please, save your ire this time for the Guardian where it rightfully belongs and desist from the knee-jerk reaction of blaming the Daily Mail.

I actually think there is more to this than general buffoonery . My guess is that there are those looking at recent events in the USA with envy and would like to bring
similar disorder to the streets here . Will be interesting to see if the BLM loons take the initiative shown by their comrades in the states .

http://www.voice-online.co.uk/article/black-lives-matter-uk-how-symbols-are-re-fuelling-racism

LIKE MANY eruptions of white supremacist violence, whether from the police, armed forces or fascist organisations, recent events in Charlottesville were shocking, but unsurprising.

The position of the white nationalist protester has been magnified around the world in recent years, fuelled by party political rhetoric.

Black activists in Africa began the domino effect we see surrounding the removal of white supremacist monuments with Rhodes Must Fall. This led to similar campaigns taking place in the heartland of white supremacist colonialism with Rhodes Must Fall in Oxford. Take Down NOLA was the first successful US city, backed by a direct action campaign, to remove statues that represent state-sanctioned racism. Black organisers, activists and their allies struggled to rid public spaces of the symbols of white supremacy intended to terrorise their communities during enslavement, racial apartheid, and beyond.

Like burning crosses and nooses hanging from trees, the statue of Robert E. Lee being torn down in Charlottesville wasn’t a historical relic, but a potent symbol of racism’s present. These actions aren’t about erasing the past, but enabling our communities to reflect a collective history, rather than the remembrance of a racist

Trump’s administration has courted white nationalist allies from across Europe, and the events in Charlottesville will embolden these factions. We are prepared to see an increase in white nationalist and white supremacist response. While far-right groups patrol the Mediterranean in search of ships of Africans and Arabs fleeing the conflict and climate change caused by consumption and militarism of Europe and North America, fascist forces and attacks are growing in Greece and other southern European nations where migrants often come ashore.

In Britain, the recent arrest of a ring of child sex offenders from the north has been used to fuel further racism in the streets and Westminster. The endemic child abuse which has gone on for decades at the BBC, the Conservative Party, the Catholic church, elite private schools and many of Britain’s children’s homes are treated as isolated incidents. The sexual offences of those recently arrested in Newcastle is explained through their culture, religion and race. Leading the charge in this racist moral panic isn’t just the far-right, but also the liberal left of the Labour Party, who joined the fascist S*n newspaper in condemning an entire religion, a range of ethnic groups, immigrants and ultimately, anyone identified by the state or white nationalist groups, as Muslim.

COMPLACENT

This is why we cannot accept the Twitter storm of condemnation of Trump and the Charlottesville racists, from liberal politicians and pundits here in Britain. Too many of them point the finger at Trump, while remaining blind to their own complicity in the racism taking place among Britain’s press, politicians and borders.

While we rightly celebrate the Battle of Lewisham, an anti-fascist confrontation which forced white nationalism into retreat from one of south London’s most diverse boroughs in 1977, we cannot for a moment become complacent. The fascists will use this upsurge and presidential support of hatred to mobilise, particularly in Muslim and immigrant areas.

While our Prime Minister literally holds hands with Trump, the Queen keeps his State visit an open invitation and the liberal Labour Party find their voice among the fascist tabloids, it is up to black, Muslim and allied communities to join and lead the struggle against the white nationalism which threatens us all. When the liberal politicians try to court our communities, we will remember this moment. When the fascists march on our communities, they will be stopped in their tracks. And if Trump visits Britain, he can expect to get nothing less than the fascists in Boston: a total shutdown.

 

[jakarta]

For me the most disgusting statue in London (apart from the one of the LIFFE trader complete with housebrick mobile phone in Cannon Street, obviously) is that of Bomber Harris, unveiled in front of a London church by the Queen Mother in 1992. Sake!

Bert Harris did what he was asked to do by Churchill and the War Cabinet in 1942.

Horrible though it was Area Bombing was the only way of attacking Germany for years and it became the Second Front until 1944, taking men and materials away from the Eastern Front to aid the Russians (Bomber Command was apparently the only Allied Force Stalin ever complimented).

The fact that German Industry achieved so much production of tanks, aircraft etc. as they did in the face of this onslaught leads you to think what they might have done if they hadn't been so heavily bombed.

My take on this is that the 55,000 young men of Bomber Command who died are the reason for his statue being outside the RAF Church St Clement Danes, along with Hugh Dowding of Fighter Command. I also think that the fact that Bomber Command Veterans have never been awarded a Campaign Medal is a lasting disgrace.

By the way if you believe the guff about the Americans bombing industrial/military targets in a precision manner because they did it by day I suggest you read Target Berlin by Ethell & Price which describes the first large scale daylight raid on Berlin in March 1944. To summarise even after nearly two years effort hardly any of the bombs landed on the intended targets and most people killed were civilians.

Bomber Command helped bring forward the demise of the Nazi Regime and in my opinion it is not an issue about their leader being commemorated.

Yes I should get out more and earlier today I did. Had to go to Chichester to pick up Mrs Jakarta's car and saw one of the Goodwood based Spitfires in circuit lowering his wheels for landing. Lump in throat time...

 

[daveinprague]

The Dancing House building here was built on the area destroyed by US Bombers precision bombing. They mistook Prague for Dresden. When you manage to bomb the wrong city, I'm not sure their precision criteria was the same as other nations I think i read the USAAF was also assigned to bomb Dresden as well but didn't due to weather

 

[oneillco]

I do wish the Left would own their own f**k ups. Don't forget the rule kids - if you want to deflect then mention the Daily Mail. Works 100% of the time. This originated in the urban SJW's newspaper of choice. This columnist was paid to virtue-signal. She probably is feeling quite pleased with herself and can't wait to spout some new controversy for which she will also get handsomely paid. Whilst of course no-one is entertaining the idea at all, it still doesn't excuse the fact that the Guardian ran with this egotistical nonsense and showed this class of political activism for what it is - self-indulgent, badly thought-out, hyperbolic nonsense.

It also shows the priorities for these SJWs as I've previously alluded to. Of course Nelson's Column won't get pulled down - that's not what irritates people. It's that the people who come up with this buffoonery are given column inches in the first place. It's not just a waste of time, it's counter-productive. You know that as well as I do. So please, save your ire this time for the Guardian where it rightfully belongs and desist from the knee-jerk reaction of blaming the Daily Mail.

Thanks for the lecture; my point is that the poll is ridiculous because there is no proposal to pull the column down. A swift Google search will show you that the Mail and Express are the frothing at the mouth over someone's opinion piece that would otherwise be ignored. I don't know what an SJW is so don't know if I am one, but I do read the Independent.

 

[Buzzer]

Thanks for the lecture; my point is that the poll is ridiculous because there is no proposal to pull the column down. A swift Google search will show you that the Mail and Express are the frothing at the mouth over someone's opinion piece that would otherwise be ignored. I don't know what an SJW is so don't know if I am one, but I do read the Independent.

You're welcome.

 

[looney]

Should we listen to the cry to pull down Nelson?

The cry?

One nutbar in the low circulation Gaurdian.

 

[oneillco]

You're welcome.

It must be a great comfort for you to have Katie Hopkins articulate your world view in her unprovocative and rational articles.

 

[jakarta]

The Dancing House building here was built on the area destroyed by US Bombers precision bombing. They mistook Prague for Dresden. When you manage to bomb the wrong city, I'm not sure their precision criteria was the same as other nations I think i read the USAAF was also assigned to bomb Dresden as well but didn't due to weather

I remember my late father-in-law had no great opinion of the USAAF but are you sure? Dresden is over 90 miles from Prague, that is one hell of a navigational ****-up...

 

[Buzzer]

It must be a great comfort for you to have Katie Hopkins articulate your world view in her unprovocative and rational articles.

Oh blimey. We've got full house in the leftie bingo. Daily Mail and now Hopkins!

Your knee-jerk reaction to this in projecting it as a right-wing conspiracy has blinded you to the fact that this Ms Hirsch is merely a left-wing version of Hopkins, a woman that I can't abide. I know, difficult for you to understand in your binary world how someone can dislike left and right-wing polemicists but there you go.

Hopkins was paid handsomely by a right-wing rag to write divisive, incendiary articles with an agenda to pander to a certain political slant and portray the people she dislikes as a caricature, forever the bad guy. Partly, the purpose was to drive a wedge between people but the newspaper is also happy because it gets people talking about the articles. They put circulation above responsible reporting. The Guardian and Ms Hirsch are equal and opposite to that. The Mail and the Express are reacting in precisely the way that they, Ms Hirsch and the Guardian, want and it's exactly the same way that lefties react whenever Hopkins spouts her filth on whatever she wants to vent her spleen on. And quite understandably too. It's only human nature to be exasperated by loud-mouth malefactors.

And the moment you come to realise that they are two sides of the same coin will probably be the moment that you stop accusing people who disagree with you of supporting Hopkins and it might also make you think before you look to blame the Daily Mail for every problem in the world. I live in hope.

 

[oneillco]

Oh blimey. We've got full house in the leftie bingo. Daily Mail and now Hopkins!

Your knee-jerk reaction to this in projecting it as a right-wing conspiracy has blinded you to the fact that this Ms Hirsch is merely a left-wing version of Hopkins, a woman that I can't abide. I know, difficult for you to understand in your binary world how someone can dislike left and right-wing polemicists but there you go.

Hopkins was paid handsomely by a right-wing rag to write divisive, incendiary articles with an agenda to pander to a certain political slant and portray the people she dislikes as a caricature, forever the bad guy. Partly, the purpose was to drive a wedge between people but the newspaper is also happy because it gets people talking about the articles. They put circulation above responsible reporting. The Guardian and Ms Hirsch are equal and opposite to that. The Mail and the Express are reacting in precisely the way that they, Ms Hirsch and the Guardian, want and it's exactly the same way that lefties react whenever Hopkins spouts her filth on whatever she wants to vent her spleen on. And quite understandably too. It's only human nature to be exasperated by loud-mouth malefactors.

And the moment you come to realise that they are two sides of the same coin will probably be the moment that you stop accusing people who disagree with you of supporting Hopkins and it might also make you think before you look to blame the Daily Mail for every problem in the world. I live in hope.

Nope, I really have better things to do than bother reading your essay, but I'm sure it's very good...

 

[Buzzer]

Nope, I really have better things to do than bother reading your essay, but I'm sure it's very good...

Better than your attempt at quoting my post. That's for sure. Sorry that a three and a bit paragraph response is a bit much for you. Next time I'll remember to keep it to a couple of lines and nothing more than two syllable words.

 

[Bladders]

Better than your attempt at quoting my post. That's for sure. Sorry that a three and a bit paragraph response is a bit much for you. Next time I'll remember to keep it to a couple of lines and nothing more than two syllable words.

He'd ran out of a coherent argument a few posts back anyway.

 

[The Rivet]

The cry?

One nutbar in the low circulation Gaurdian.

Are you a little upset at the wording? We can all spin, left, right, centrist or just don't know. Fun isn't it?