Missing Woman in London

[clapham_gull]

Let’s be honest though. What we’re seeing there was not a peaceful vigil.

Of course, but the MET have to look at their responses this week. There are on the backfoot already with five referrals to to the Independent Office for Police Conduct

Crises management, they clearly do not do.

 

[Weststander]

Of course, but the MET have to look at their responses this week. There are on the backfoot already with five referrals to to the Independent Office for Police Conduct

Crises management, they clearly do not do.

What’s the crisis?

 

[clapham_gull]

I got your female point the first time.

In the Bristol and Clapham vigils, some speakers turned on male hacks and photographers with “vultures” and “not your space”.

It's clearly toxic I understand, but the MET have dealt badly with it. We are in the middle of a culture war anyway and the organisation lacks the nuance and intelligence to deal with it. I'm not anti Police at all, but have lived up here long enough to witness enough occurrences when they have failed when the shit hits the fan. I have spoken to Sussex Police who agree they are of a different breed.

 

[Weststander]

It's clearly toxic I understand, but the MET have dealt badly with it. We are in the middle of a culture war anyway and the organisation lacks the nuance and intelligence to deal with it. I'm not anti Police at all, but have lived up here long enough to witness enough occurrences when they have failed when the shit hits the fan. I have spoken to Sussex Police who agree they are of a different breed.

They always have been. More arrogant/confident (take your pick) and very outspoken on duty .... we chatted to some in Whitehall not that many years ago. Perhaps dealing with everything they have to, makes them battle hardened?

The NSC debate should’ve in the main stayed focused on sexual violence from men.

All the many callers I heard last week on R5 and LBC didn’t disparage the Met. They only wanted to talk about the effect of predatory men on their lives past and present.

 

[e77]

What’s the crisis?

A Diplomatic Protection officer - presumably cleared to use fire arms - has been arrested and charged with the murder of a woman whose body was found in a builders sack miles away so mutilated she needed to be identified by dental records. This followed an indecent exposure incident that has already been referred to the complaints body so one might safely conclude the handling of it the incident wasn't exactly by the book. Speaking in general terms any Police officer is vigorously background checked and a firearms officer would be psychologically tested.

In a subsequent vigil/protest (let's not fall out over it's description) the same Police force waited until night before dragging women away.

If anyone can't see how the second is going to at the very least going to be extremely poor optics in the same week as the first they possibly need to reflect on the nature of modern media and society.

I use my words cautiously because no has been convicted of anything but that suggests an organisation that has lost control of the situation and is fast losing public support.

 

[clapham_gull]

A Diplomatic Protection officer - presumably cleared to use fire arms - has been arrested and charged with the murder of a woman whose body was found in a builders sack miles away so mutilated she needed to be identified by dental records. This followed an indecent exposure incident that has already been referred to the complaints body so one might safely conclude the handling of it the incident wasn't exactly by the book. Speaking in general terms any Police officer is vigorously background checked and a firearms officer would be psychologically tested.

In a subsequent vigil/protest (let's not fall out over it's description) the same Police force waited until night before dragging women away.

If anyone can't see how the second is going to at the very least going to be extremely poor optics in the same week as the first they possibly need to reflect on the nature of modern media and society.

I use my words cautiously because no has been convicted of anything but that suggests an organisation that has lost control of the situation and is fast losing public support.

And for my safety the do need to retain control of the situation.

Apologies to anyone if I come across as an anti Police. I am very much not so.

But the post events of the last few days reminded very strongly of the Jean Charles de Menezes incident which I was very "close" to and has coloured my opinion of of the organisation if not the Police on the ground doing their thing.

Lead by donkeys I'm afraid.

 

[Razzoo]

This thread should be renamed now. Sarah Everard RIP as a small mark of respect.

 

[vagabond]

A Diplomatic Protection officer - presumably cleared to use fire arms - has been arrested and charged with the murder of a woman whose body was found in a builders sack miles away so mutilated she needed to be identified by dental records. This followed an indecent exposure incident that has already been referred to the complaints body so one might safely conclude the handling of it the incident wasn't exactly by the book. Speaking in general terms any Police officer is vigorously background checked and a firearms officer would be psychologically tested.

In a subsequent vigil/protest (let's not fall out over it's description) the same Police force waited until night before dragging women away.

If anyone can't see how the second is going to at the very least going to be extremely poor optics in the same week as the first they possibly need to reflect on the nature of modern media and society.

I use my words cautiously because no has been convicted of anything but that suggests an organisation that has lost control of the situation and is fast losing public support.

I think everyone knows the story and is naturally appalled by it. But this vigil was not authorised to go ahead. We are in a global pandemic and supposed to be in lockdown maintaining social distancing.

The poor coppers I’ve seen in the videos are not in the midst of a peaceful vigil at all. It’s a protest and an angry one. And it’s an important distinction to make.

The police do not make the laws but it is their job to uphold them. I’m sure these people would be angry and upset if we have to have another lockdown which would do further damage to jobs and our economy.

 

[vagabond]

Apologies to anyone if I come across as an anti Police. I am very much not so.
.

I don’t think you do, don’t worry [emoji106]

 

[e77]

And for my safety the do need to retain control of the situation.

Apologies to anyone if I come across as an anti Police. I am very much not so.

But the post events of the last few days reminded very strongly of the Jean Charles de Menezes incident which I was very "close" to and has coloured my opinion of of the organisation if not the Police on the ground doing their thing.

Lead by donkeys I'm afraid.

Never lived in London - although the lot that Policed football matches in the early 00s were ********s - so can't comment on the day to day performance of the Met but I am actually supportive of the Police doing a difficult job in increasingly difficult circumstances. Indeed Sussex Police dispersed the Brighton equivalent gathering with a minimum of fuss.

You mention Jean Charles de Menezes being shot and I see the similarities because at the moment the Met are just digging a hole for themselves.

 

[clapham_gull]

Response from the MET tonight

Statement from Assistant Commissioner Helen Ball following events in Clapham Common:

"May I start by extending my deepest condolences to the family and friends of Sarah Everard. Across the Met we are still extremely saddened and shocked by the tragic circumstance of her disappearance and death.

"Earlier tonight, I joined the Commissioner in a candlelit vigil outside New Scotland Yard. I know many thousands of people up and down the nation also held similar vigils in Sarah’s name.

"I recognise that the decision by the organisers to cancel the Reclaim These Streets vigil in Clapham Common was deeply unwelcome news. Even so, given the ever present threat of Coronavirus, this was the right decision to make.

"Today, for over six hours hundreds of people came to lay flowers and pay their respects to Sarah in Clapham Common in a safe and lawful way.

"Around 6pm, more people began to gather close to the bandstand within the Common. Some started to make speeches from the bandstand. These speeches then attracted more people to gather closer together.

"At this point, officers on the ground were faced with a very difficult decision. Hundreds of people were packed tightly together, posing a very real risk of easily transmitting Covid-19.

"Police must act for people's safety, this is the only responsible thing to do. The pandemic is not over and gatherings of people from right across London and beyond, are still not safe.

"Those who gathered were spoken to by officers on a number of occasions and over an extended period of time. We repeatedly encouraged those who were there to comply with the law and leave. Regrettably, a small minority of people began chanting at officers, pushing and throwing items.

"After speaking with officers, the vast majority of people quickly left. Four arrests have been made for public order offences and for breaches of the Health Protection Regulations.

"Part of the reason I am speaking to you tonight is because we accept that the actions of our officers have been questioned.

"We absolutely did not want to be in a position where enforcement action was necessary. But we were placed in this position because of the overriding need to protect people’s safety.

"Let me end by saying that across the Met, we review every single event that we police to see if there are lessons that can be learnt. This one will be no different."

https://news.met.police.uk/news/sta...all-following-events-in-clapham-common-423210

 

[e77]

I think everyone knows the story and is naturally appalled by it. But this vigil was not authorised to go ahead. We are in a global pandemic and supposed to be in lockdown maintaining social distancing.

The poor coppers I’ve seen in the videos are not in the midst of a peaceful vigil at all. It’s a protest and an angry one. And it’s an important distinction to make.

The police do not make the laws but it is their job to uphold them. I’m sure these people would be angry and upset if we have to have another lockdown which would do further damage to jobs and our economy.

From what I could see the Police should have just retreated and not got involved and let it fizzle out naturally, a tactic used elsewhere. There are countless examples of the Police not enforcing the letter of the law in the interest of public relations and common sense.

As it stands the nurses protest in Manchester ended up with a 65 year old woman get fined £10,000 followed by this is going to feed the narrative they are bullies who pick on minorities and women. TBH at the moment that is what it is beginning to look like to me.

If nothing else the fact that politicians of all sides have criticised them and the Commissioner looks fairly likely to lose her job would suggest a crises in itself.

 

[sydney]

The police have lost the plot. All this lockdown power has got out of control.

unfortunately , looks like this.

aside to that it would appear, as someone else said .....the country is ****ed.

there appears to be no reasoning with these heavy handed , power crazed morons in uniform , they have always had the wholesale support of the community but scenes like this do them no favours .....at all.

 

[vagabond]

From what I could see the Police should have just retreated and not got involved and let it fizzle out naturally, a tactic used elsewhere. There are countless examples of the Police not enforcing the letter of the law in the interest of public relations and common sense.

As it stands the nurses protest in Manchester ended up with a 65 year old woman get fined £10,000 followed by this is going to feed the narrative they are bullies who pick on minorities and women. TBH at the moment that is what it is beginning to look like to me.

If nothing else the fact that politicians of all sides have criticised them and the Commissioner looks fairly likely to lose her job would suggest a crises in itself.

From what I could see the Police should have just retreated and not got involved

The police are there to try and uphold the law. They don’t make the laws. It has been agreed by the government that we’re in lockdown, social distancing has to be upheld, and this mass gathering was not allowed to go ahead.

See whilst the police may or may not have dealt with things perfectly in hindsight (easy to say after events), I believe in personal culpability and common sense as well.

No one is disputing this is an horrific crime.

But it’s a global pandemic. People have lost lives. Livelihoods have been lost. This is our second lockdown. Why are there hundreds of peoples together in one place, many without masks? They are the ones breaking the law here putting the police in that position, not to mention the risk to public health.

 

[Perfidious Albion]

I think everyone knows the story and is naturally appalled by it. But this vigil was not authorised to go ahead. We are in a global pandemic and supposed to be in lockdown maintaining social distancing.

The poor coppers I’ve seen in the videos are not in the midst of a peaceful vigil at all. It’s a protest and an angry one. And it’s an important distinction to make.

The police do not make the laws but it is their job to uphold them. I’m sure these people would be angry and upset if we have to have another lockdown which would do further damage to jobs and our economy.

What ####### fools want to defy the law and congregate in a pointless “vigil “ in the throes of the pandemic?
A friend of mine died of Covid last week . That hit me harder than all the big numbers nationally. They are likely to catch it and kill off their granny.

 

[Gwylan]

The police are there to try and uphold the law. They don’t make the laws. It has been agreed by the government that we’re in lockdown, social distancing has to be upheld, and this mass gathering was not allowed to go ahead.

See whilst the police may or may not have dealt with things perfectly in hindsight (easy to say after events), I believe in personal culpability and common sense as well.

And yet a mass gathering in Glasgow last weekend - far bigger and with far less social distancing - is lightly policed.

The difference is, of course, that was nearly all male. Vagabond has no problem with mass gatherings of men but let women get involved and it's another story.

However, you paint it, this is a shocking behaviour by the police. Women protesting violence against women are treated violently. Given the circumstances, they should have stood back and let the protest peacefully fizzle out. All they've done is inflame the situation.

 

[Pretty Plnk Fairy]

All started when some tofu eating leftys gave them the vote and now their out with the saucepans creating mayhem. Wouldnt happen in glasgow

Regards

DF

 

[Guinness Boy]

And yet a mass gathering in Glasgow last weekend - far bigger and with far less social distancing - is lightly policed.

The difference is, of course, that was nearly all male. Vagabond has no problem with mass gatherings of men but let women get involved and it's another story.

However, you paint it, this is a shocking behaviour by the police. Women protesting violence against women are treated violently. Given the circumstances, they should have stood back and let the protest peacefully fizzle out. All they've done is inflame the situation.

This. Rangers fans left alone. Liverpool fans left alone. Footy Lads allowed to rampage round London for a whole day. Women stood peacefully in a bandstand are cuffed and manhandled into a van (and, BTW, what if they were Covid free but the officer arresting was a carrier?).

Utterly disgraceful. Cressida Dick has to go today. She's ultimately responsible for Diplomatic Protection employing a wrong 'un and her officers overreacting afterwards. And those are hardly her first screw ups either. Dreadful woman.

 

[Guinness Boy]

What ####### fools want to defy the law and congregate in a pointless “vigil “ in the throes of the pandemic?
A friend of mine died of Covid last week . That hit me harder than all the big numbers nationally. They are likely to catch it and kill off their granny.

I think you ought to read this:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...der-myth-can-inform-uks-future-covid-response

"According to Prof Mark Woolhouse, an epidemiologist at Edinburgh University who sits on the government’s SPI-M committee, the chance of a super-spreader event among the crowds that turned up from Bournemouth to Southend was minimal in theory – and nonexistent in practice."

 

[Thunder Bolt]

What ####### fools want to defy the law and congregate in a pointless “vigil “ in the throes of the pandemic?
A friend of mine died of Covid last week . That hit me harder than all the big numbers nationally. They are likely to catch it and kill off their granny.

A pointless vigil?

The Duchess of Cambridge also visited Clapham Common to pay her respects. When is she to be arrested for defying the law?

Please link me to your posts condemning the Rangers fans celebrating. I’ll wait.