[Football] Middlesbrough Set To Sue EFL

[studio150]

Looks like Middlesbrough still have the huff over Derby passing the FFP regulations by selling their ground to effectively their owner at twice the price the ground was worth on the accounting books.

Not sure what financial loss Middlesbrough will seek to cover but play off final always billed as the £100m+ game.

Will be interesting to see how this progresses

 

[Albion my Albion]

**** Boro!

 

[B-right-on]

Lot of clubs do things to get around the rules (apparently). Hard to prove it in the end as its worth what someone is willing to pay.

 

[Codner pharmaceuticals]

So long as Mike Dean is the judge they will win

 

[Gritt23]

Lot of clubs do things to get around the rules (apparently). Hard to prove it in the end as its worth what someone is willing to pay.

Not that hard. You get an independent valuer to run the rule over it, just as you would do to get a loan against an asset. You get a limit on LTV, and the bank would just let you inflate the value to whatever you needed for the LTV calculation to work.

I wonder whether whether Boro are actually after Derby in all of this, or just trying to blow a whole in the FFP regulations, and show that they are worthless, unenforceable, and therefore either need tightening up or just done away with, as they really have no point in being there if accountants can just drive a truck through them.

Sadly my view is that FFP is a solid idea, but VERY difficult to enforce as there are some very hard things to value around sponsorship and marketing.

 

[Paris]

The sense of entitlement at clubs like Boro is mind-bending.

Regarding Woodgate, I had a feeling he might struggle as manager when Gibson appointed him. He'll be given time. Unfortunately for their fans that might lead to leaving the Championship in the southerly direction.

 

[Dorset Seagull]

Not sure of the wording of FFP but I guess the ground is worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

So they are arguing that Derby should have had a points deduction ?

Well if there has been any rule breaking then they should have. If it is not in the rules, then there seems to be no merit in this legal action.

 

[Paris]

So they are arguing that Derby should have had a points deduction ?

Well if there has been any rule breaking then they should have. If it is not in the rules, then there seems to be no merit in this legal action.

Echoes of that whole Spygate fiasco last season.
Weren't Boro one of many Championship teams demanding Leeds be deducted points too?

Gibson has been given the reputation of a decent, honourable chairman over the years, but they appear to be a snide outfit.

 

[Braggfan]

The sense of entitlement at clubs like Boro is mind-bending.

Regarding Woodgate, I had a feeling he might struggle as manager when Gibson appointed him. He'll be given time. Unfortunately for their fans that might lead to leaving the Championship in the southerly direction.

I don't think its a sense of entitlement to play by the rules and be annoyed when other clubs don't. Paul Barber made a big point of how we were sticking by it and clubs like Bournemouth and Leicester weren't, and I don't think that made us entitled. I think it's great that Middlesbrough are taking a stand, I wish more clubs were willing to rather than just playing along.

 

[SollysLeftFoot]

There is literally nothing good about Middlesbrough. I hate that part of England despise the club, am I being petulant? you bet. But that won't stop me from having a strong dislike of them.

 

[theonlymikey]

There is literally nothing good about Middlesbrough. I hate that part of England despise the club, am I being petulant? you bet. But that won't stop me from having a strong dislike of them.

Yes you're being a petulant idiot and clearly know nothing about the area. Well, other the constantly reported deprivation for which has been caused by stereotypical contempt for the north, by the south via industrial destruction and lack of investment. Remind me where Brighton is based again? I digress...

Onto the matter at hand... the move by Gibson, is more than likely to shed light on the dodgy dealings of clubs trying to avoid FFP sanctions.

If there is 1 point or goal difference separate clubs from an Auto space ala Brighton, or a play off place ala Boro, and you feel the gaining party has played unfairly, you have a right to challenge this.

This stems from EFL clubs refusing a motion to allow independent scrutiny of their books. I wonder why that might be if you have nothing to hide?

Mel Morris goaded Steve with his public comments after this was voted against.

I see on Derby's board, they are calling it good and clever business. In my opinion, if you have to rely on flogging assets, it is the opposite of running a good business, and is dangerous. Ask Darlington and Bury what the implications of not having a club owned stadium were. For if FFP ha snot been broken by Derby, the rules still need to be changed to avoid this practice because it is a dangerous for the future of any club.

 

[El Presidente]

Yes you're being a petulant idiot and clearly know nothing about the area. Well, other the constantly reported deprivation for which has been caused by stereotypical contempt for the north, by the south via industrial destruction and lack of investment. Remind me where Brighton is based again? I digress...

Onto the matter at hand... the move by Gibson, is more than likely to shed light on the dodgy dealings of clubs trying to avoid FFP sanctions.

If there is 1 point or goal difference separate clubs from an Auto space ala Brighton, or a play off place ala Boro, and you feel the gaining party has played unfairly, you have a right to challenge this.

This stems from EFL clubs refusing a motion to allow independent scrutiny of their books. I wonder why that might be if you have nothing to hide?

Mel Morris goaded Steve with his public comments after this was voted against.

I see on Derby's board, they are calling it good and clever business. In my opinion, if you have to rely on flogging assets, it is the opposite of running a good business, and is dangerous. Ask Darlington and Bury what the implications of not having a club owned stadium were. For if FFP ha snot been broken by Derby, the rules still need to be changed to avoid this practice because it is a dangerous for the future of any club.

Brighton and Hove Albion Football Club Limited don’t own their stadium...but I don’t think there’s anything to worry about.

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[Icy Gull]

After THAT game and the way Boro fans behaved, having got promoted, I am enjoying every distressing thing that happens to them and their fans. I know that I am showing the same complete lack of class they showed towards us, it’s not big and it’s not clever but......schadenfreude

 

[Simster]

Like, I suspect, most of us on here I both agree with Middlesbrough's stand on this and yet find myself very amused that they are the ones riled and affected by this because I still don't like them after that season and that match in particular.

 

[Paris]

I don't think its a sense of entitlement to play by the rules and be annoyed when other clubs don't. Paul Barber made a big point of how we were sticking by it and clubs like Bournemouth and Leicester weren't, and I don't think that made us entitled. I think it's great that Middlesbrough are taking a stand, I wish more clubs were willing to rather than just playing along.

You miss the point that was made by another poster on this thread. Derby haven't broken any FFP law. It's a tad close to the line, granted but they haven't. Same with Leeds and Spygate last season. Sour grapes from Boro.

Entitlement: 'The expectation of special treatment from others'. Sounds about right, given the demand for points deductions for other clubs on a regular basis.

 

[El Presidente]

There’s three issues here

1: Why did the EFL change the rules in 2016 allowing clubs to include the profit on selling stadia for FFP when previously it had been prohibited?

2: Why did the EFL accept the Derby stadium valuation of £80m when others were valued at much lower figures (Sheffield Wednesday £60m, Aston Villa £56.7m, West Ham £40m, Reading £26.5m).

3: Is there a conflict of interest when the seller of the stadium is Mel Morris, the buyer of the stadium is Mel Morris, the surveyors valuing the stadium are paid by Mel Morris and the auditors who sign off the accounts are appointed and paid by Mel Morris.



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[El Presidente]

Again it’s nothing illegal or breaking any rules, but Steve Gibson at Boro uses the losses made by the Football club he owns to reduce the tax payable by his other businesses via something called group relief...which I thought was something that took place in some of my private DVD collection.

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[Braggfan]

You miss the point that was made by another poster on this thread. Derby haven't broken any FFP law. It's a tad close to the line, granted but they haven't. Same with Leeds and Spygate last season. Sour grapes from Boro.

Entitlement: 'The expectation of special treatment from others'. Sounds about right, given this demand for points deductions for other clubs on a regular basis.

Just to clear up my point, i'm not disagreeing with people disliking Middlesbrough,its completely part of football to have rivalries Every fan has teams they like and dislike. However, I think Middlesbrough are right to be annoyed. The problem the championship has is that there are sides that are willing to bend and break the rules because the rewards are so high, and other clubs are prepared to let them do it because they know that given the opportunity they'd sell their own grandmother if it meant they could get in the Premier League.
There's a time and a place for our rivalries but there is also a time and a place for standing together with other clubs and those who are fighting the corruption and cheating in the game. If we don't stand by them and join them in saying that it's wrong, then we're just part of the many that allow and condone these problems to plague the game.

 

[Jim D]

Again it’s nothing illegal or breaking any rules, but Steve Gibson at Boro uses the losses made by the Football club he owns to reduce the tax payable by his other businesses via something called group relief...which I thought was something that took place in some of my private DVD collection.

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I'm not going to open that link in case it's something from your DVD collection.