Luck ?

[symyjym]

I wouldn't disagree about the need for more attacking football, particularly after the tedious brand served up by Oscar.

But Sami's tactics (as is being proved on a seemingly weekly basis) are flawed. You cannot push the full-backs so far up that the defence is exposed, even if the midfielders slot in to RB and LB, which is apparently the idea (according to one of his scouts), you are left with slower players in speed positions, and one midfielder covering the majority of the pitch centrally.

Whether we like it or not McClaren, Howe, McCarthy and even Walburton at Brentford, have shown that attacking football can be played with a solid defence.

Oscar got the balance right with the players he had to be fair. I wouldn't define his brand as tedious and I was hoping to see how he would have been at Watford before I judged and labeled his style.

But aside from that even Everton are making the same mistakes as us but is that down to Martinez or the players making mistakes in vunerable areas?

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Oscar got the balance right with the players he had to be fair. I wouldn't define his brand as tedious and I was hoping to see how he would have been at Watford before I judged and labeled his style.

But aside from that even Everton are making the same mistakes as us but is that down to Martinez or the players making mistakes in vunerable areas?

I don't think Oscar did at all (though of course that outcome justified the means), but surely it cannot be right to have a prolific forward like Ulloa and rarely get numbers to support him, check out our goals scored last season.

With Everton the difference is surely the results compared to ours, isn't it?

 

[8ace]

Luck, chance and randomness is one of favourite subjects, some further reading (in order of preference):

The Signal and the Noise - by Nate Silver.
Innumeracy - by John Allen Paulos.
Fooled By Randomness - by Nassim Nicholas Taleb.
The Black Swan - by Nassim Nicholas Taleb.
The Drunkard's Walk - by Leonard Mlodinow.

 

[symyjym]

I don't think Oscar did at all (though of course that outcome justified the means), but surely it cannot be right to have a prolific forward like Ulloa and rarely get numbers to support him, check out our goals scored last season.

With Everton the difference is surely the results compared to ours, isn't it?

We didn't have players with pace last season. We had Orlandi, SLopez and a buckled Buckley. Having KLL and March didn't make up for our shortcomings over 90 mins.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

But we created more with those players under Poyet.

 

[symyjym]

That’s arguable, Lopez was frustrating under both, and Buckley and Orlandi couldn’t last a full game if they were fit enough to even be selected.

 

[British Bulldog]

Our current position has got nothing to do with bad luck it's just down to bad management, Look at how many injuries Oscar had to contend with last season and it wasn't just the injuries look at how many times we hit the woodwork last season as well. If it wasn't for bad luck Oscar wouldn't have had any luck at all but he still kept us competitive and got us into the play off's rather than the relegation place that Hyypia has us sitting in.

 

[8ace]

Hyypia has also had good luck that we played Birmingham, Bolton, Cardiff, Wigan and Watford before they got a change in management/were between managers.

 

[Justice]

When your at the top everything goes your way, when your dicking about at the bottom nothing goes for you.

 

[Blues Rock DJ]

" If it wasn't for bad luck, wouldn't have no luck at all " .........

 

[B.W.]

I am not saying that the situation we are in is entirely due to bad luck, but look at Saturday, for 15 mins we murdered then, Kaz went off, the keeper makes a save with his foot, which he had no idea about. Again I think we had more shots and possession, they score a good goal, then a very lucky one. Although there is no bad luck in those free kicks, appalling at that level. Think we need a little bit of luck, which we have not had this year, we have not been thrashed this year and on what i have seen, only Boro and Wigan, did we not deserve anything and maybe Rotherham. but Brentford, with a bit of luck we could have been 2-0 up, before they scored, Ipswich, all over them and lost, Cardiff, Marshall plays a blinder etc etc. Think we have issues on confidence and strange tactics at times, but we don't seem to get the rub of the green sometimes. To quote Ralph Waldo Emerson ' there is only one way to change your luck and that is by altering your thoughts'

Clutching at straws.

 

[Mellotron]

I am not saying that the situation we are in is entirely due to bad luck, but look at Saturday, for 15 mins we murdered then, Kaz went off, the keeper makes a save with his foot, which he had no idea about. Again I think we had more shots and possession, they score a good goal, then a very lucky one. Although there is no bad luck in those free kicks, appalling at that level. Think we need a little bit of luck, which we have not had this year, we have not been thrashed this year and on what i have seen, only Boro and Wigan, did we not deserve anything and maybe Rotherham. but Brentford, with a bit of luck we could have been 2-0 up, before they scored, Ipswich, all over them and lost, Cardiff, Marshall plays a blinder etc etc. Think we have issues on confidence and strange tactics at times, but we don't seem to get the rub of the green sometimes. To quote Ralph Waldo Emerson ' there is only one way to change your luck and that is by altering your thoughts'

What's "unlucky" about only have ONE creative attacking midfielder on your bench, who can't get through 70 minutes anyway?!

Nothing to do with luck and all to do with bad management - we started the game very well and then completely handed initiative back to Fulham through our manager's substitution. Tex or McCourt should've come on, or even bring on Holla and move JFC up to an advance position.

Also, it's not unlucky to concede a deflected goal from the edge of the area when we invite SHOT AFTER SHOT AFTER SHOT due to having a non-existent central midfield. One of them is bound to go in at some point.

Nothing to do with luck, the Fulham game.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

That’s arguable, Lopez was frustrating under both, and Buckley and Orlandi couldn’t last a full game if they were fit enough to even be selected.

Not sure it is if you look at the games and goals scored.

We slaughtered Blackpool and Barnsley in Poyet's last year, with the exception of Leicester away (who by all accounts were still celebrating), we didn't give anyone a proper pasting under Oscar.

Under Poyet, you could also throw in Palace and even the last game vs Wolves was a 2-0 hammering really...... I never felt the same thrill watching Oscars team, and now although Sami is trying, his tactics are simply not good enough.

 

[symyjym]

Not sure it is if you look at the games and goals scored.

We slaughtered Blackpool and Barnsley in Poyet's last year, with the exception of Leicester away (who by all accounts were still celebrating), we didn't give anyone a proper pasting under Oscar.

Under Poyet, you could also throw in Palace and even the last game vs Wolves was a 2-0 hammering really...... I never felt the same thrill watching Oscars team, and now although Sami is trying, his tactics are simply not good enough.

Poyet had a much stronger squad than Oscar, and even then I wouldn't say it was anymore more exciting. It was frustrating watching both to be fair, but Poyet chose to set up defensively, Oscar didn't have any choice.

With regard to Lopez there was one game when he took 3 corners on the trot and over hit them all. That shouldn't happen just because of a change of manager.

Anyway I am sure we had this debate, or something along the lines of, at the end of last season and we both came to the conclusion that we both disagreed with each other

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Poyet had a much stronger squad than Oscar, and even then I wouldn't say it was anymore more exciting. It was frustrating watching both to be fair, but Poyet chose to set up defensively, Oscar didn't have any choice.

With regard to Lopez there was one game when he took 3 corners on the trot and over hit them all. That shouldn't happen just because of a change of manager.

Anyway I am sure we had this debate, or something along the lines of, at the end of last season and we both came to the conclusion that we both disagreed with each other

You could well be right...... Great stuff though.......

 

[Brighton Mod]

When your at the top everything goes your way, when your dicking about at the bottom nothing goes for you.

Which comes first, the position or the luck? We all started in the same position.

 

[symyjym]

Which comes first, the position or the luck? We all started in the same position.

Poyet and Garcia used all our luck so by the law of averages Sami surely has to make up for it