[Politics] Liz Truss **RESIGNS 20/10/2022**

[peterward]

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Pity it’s recorded on Thursdays…..

 

[clapham_gull]

Pity it’s recorded on Thursdays…..

Yes and no. I bet they are thanking the cameraman who just about caught them predicting today's events before filming proper started.

 

[Randy McNob]

Until the opposition come up with something better.

A Labour or coalition government would automatically be better than the current shitshow. Mainly because the Tories are being run by a populist far right sect who have to keep the Brexit banner flying to justify their mandate, with all the decent majority of moderate 'real conservatives' cast to the margins. A new party would at least be unified and can choose the best cabinet based on alll the elected politicians available, not loons, opportunists, shapeshifters, who are generally in the pockets of the super rich.

 

[clapham_gull]

They only had a choice of two. I guess for some reason (can't think what), the mostly elderly white members took against the alternative to Truss.

Sunak must be chuckling away at all this.

Race had nothing to do with it. Sunak wasn't going to be forgiven for stabbing Johnson in the back. If he had stayed loyal, I think he might have crept in.

The members result was a lot closer than people thought.

 

[clapham_gull]

A Labour or coalition government would automatically be better than the current shitshow. Mainly because the Tories are being run by a populist far right sect who have to keep the Brexit banner flying to justify their mandate, with all the decent majority of moderate 'real conservatives' cast to the margins. A new party would at least be unified and can choose the best cabinet based on alll the elected politicians available, not loons, opportunists, shapeshifters, who are generally in the pockets of the super rich.

Definitely not "populist far right", with so many ethnic minorities represented at senior level.

It's far more complex than that with arguments between the home secretary who wants to limit immigration and the PM and her (neo-liberal disaster capitalist mates) who effectively want to increase it.

The Conservative party is now a number of waring factions even on Brexit. Those who think it's all about taking back the UK to a pre-Brexit "Golden Age" and those who just wanted the EU out the way so they can radically restructure the economy.

Johnson was quite a good cover because politically he was simultaneously able to express all of the views and none of them in a single paragraph.

They don't know what they stand for anymore.

I find it extraordinary that they are acting like a party that has very recently been dumped out of power, but they are in power.

Labour have allowed that to happen with their own internal in-fighting. Probably sorted them themselves out enough to win the next election, but it's a long way off.

If the sensible ones take back control of the Tories, Labour will need to fight a bit harder to offer an alternative rather than sit back and watch the Tories implode.

Starmer to his credit did hit a national nerve with the promise of a nationally owned energy company.

 

[Lenny Rider]

Andrew Marr fairly confident the games up………

 

[clapham_gull]

Andrew Marr fairly confident the games up………

He did another piece recently about how Brexit continues to split the party and it was very perceptive.

This is where Labour have an advantage over them. The Tories simply can't agree on what it means, whilst Labour can continue with their "we will pick up the pieces" message.

Where she is out of her depth is not so much as the role of Prime Minister, but picking up the pieces of the damage Brexit and Johnson have caused the party.

Both won them a huge majority but have inflicted large wounds that were always going to become infected over time.

They need a decade out of power to reinvent themselves.

 

[Lenny Rider]

He did another piece recently about how Brexit continues to split the party and it was very perceptive.

This is where Labour have an advantage over them. The Tories simply can't agree on what it means, whilst Labour can continue with their "we will pick up the pieces" message.

Where she is out of her depth is not so much as the role of Prime Minister, but picking up the pieces of the damage Brexit and Johnson have caused the party.

Both won them a huge majority but have inflicted large wounds that were always going to become infected over time.

They need a decade out of power to reinvent themselves.

But what happens to us all during that decade with the other lot in power?

Unfortunately at 58 and a bit of a cynic it’s almost a choice between sickness or the s****?

 

[clapham_gull]

But what happens to us all during that decade with the other lot in power?

Unfortunately at 58 and a bit of a cynic it’s almost a choice between sickness or the s****?

It's going to be any worse than the last 12 years is it ?

Something has to run the country and the current lot have allowed their own internal squabbles to fracture the country.

The Conservative party we knew have been blown to bits, taken over by a small lunatic fringe that even the most unhinged of them Nadine Dorries thinks have gone too far. Johnson with no politics to speak of let them in. Anyone still supporting them can't possibly define themselves as "Conservative" unless they never understood what they stood for in the first place.

If you are a small c conservative but still fear Labour are capable less economically capable than this lot, the best you can hope is for the Tories to jump off the bus and fix themselves.

 

[Guinness Boy]

BBC now reporting that many MPs are turning on her.

Tory MPs turn on Liz Truss after turbulent day

Many MPs are unhappy with the prime minister after she fired her chancellor and announced a second U-turn.

www.bbc.co.uk

The one person sticking up for her appears to be Sir Christopher Chope. This is the guy who has, during his time as MP:

• Attended climate change sceptic meetings in Westminster
• Voted against gay marriage
• Taken a hard pro-Brexit line
• Blocked a bill that would have banned upskirting
• Blocked a bill that would have protected poor countries from vulture funds, despite it being supported by the Tory party
• Blocked and filibustered a number of other private members bills while at the same time, camping outside parliament overnight so he could submit private members' bills, including ones to privatise C4 and the BBC.

These are the people in charge now. But not for very long, it seems.

 

[Randy McNob]

Definitely not "populist far right", with so many ethnic minorities represented at senior level.

It's far more complex than that with arguments between the home secretary who wants to limit immigration and the PM and her (neo-liberal disaster capitalist mates) who effectively want to increase it.

The Conservative party is now a number of waring factions even on Brexit. Those who think it's all about taking back the UK to a pre-Brexit "Golden Age" and those who just wanted the EU out the way so they can radically restructure the economy.

Johnson was quite a good cover because politically he was simultaneously able to express all of the views and none of them in a single paragraph.

They don't know what they stand for anymore.

I find it extraordinary that they are acting like a party that has very recently been dumped out of power, but they are in power.

Labour have allowed that to happen with their own internal in-fighting. Probably sorted them themselves out enough to win the next election, but it's a long way off.

If the sensible ones take back control of the Tories, Labour will need to fight a bit harder to offer an alternative rather than sit back and watch the Tories implode.

Starmer to his credit did hit a national nerve with the promise of a nationally owned energy company.

Disagree. The problem, as always, is Brexit. Their 2019 80 seat election win was to make Brexit happen come hell or high water. The decent princinpled Conservatives sit in the shadows, they are only left with the very few chancers, shapeshifters and loons.

If they wanted to admit they were wrong about Brexit and need to go back to true centre right conservatives, unite the party then they need a public mandate, a general election. No one calls a snap election if they know they will get smashed.

Theresa May called a snap election because she needed a bigger majority to push her brexit deal through parliament

Actually Labour, especially Corbyn, were spot on about resolving the Brexit deadlock. A 2nd referendum and a deal which kept us in the customs union and single market. He said you can't serve half the electorate's wants and ignore the other half, you have to find a solution that works for everyone and unite the country, and they would have "actually" got brexit done

 

[Guinness Boy]

Disagree. The problem, as always, is Brexit. Their 2019 80 seat election win was to make Brexit happen come hell or high water. The decent princinpled Conservatives sit in the shadows, they are only left with the very few chancers, shapeshifters and loons.

If they wanted to admit they were wrong about Brexit and need to go back to true centre right conservatives, unite the party then they need a public mandate, a general election. No one calls a snap election if they know they will get smashed.

Theresa May called a snap election because she needed a bigger majority to push her brexit deal through parliament

Actually Labour, especially Corbyn, were spot on about resolving the Brexit deadlock. A 2nd referendum and a deal which kept us in the customs union and single market. He said you can't serve half the electorate's wants and ignore the other half, you have to find a solution that works for everyone and unite the country

Sorry, but even as a remain voter I don't think for a second that another referendum would have united the country. It would have split it further. And Corbyn would have been as bad as Truss. You can see for yourself how someone who is all about ideology and has no leadership skills at all is fairing.

 

[rogersix]

No, it's just become exponentially worse in the last four weeks.

the cause of the last four weeks go back to 2016 and david "we're all in this together" cameron.

turns out, he wasn't quite the patriot he would have us believe he is!

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Actually Labour, especially Corbyn, were spot on about resolving the Brexit deadlock. A 2nd referendum and a deal which kept us in the customs union and single market. He said you can't serve half the electorate's wants and ignore the other half, you have to find a solution that works for everyone and unite the country, and they would have "actually" got brexit done

Without wishing to turn this into a Brexit thread, keeping the UK in the customs union and the single market would not of united the country - it would have served the wants of people who didn't want Brexit. And therein lies the challenge on that particular subject - there really isn't a middle ground - regardless of which side of the argument you sit on.

 

[rogersix]

no one likes tax. i know no one who would pay more tax than what they are asked to pay. its a means to an end. the flip side is Labour who will solve any and all problems with a few billion spending promise, usually without say what it would be spent on. it would be nice to hear policy first, pros & cons, then what it costs and options, and then how that might be raised (flatter the better). this is my dream.

you're ok voting for the tory magic money tree?

 

[WATFORD zero]

Without wishing to turn this into a Brexit thread, keeping the UK in the customs union and the single market would not of united the country - it would have served the wants of people who didn't want Brexit. And therein lies the challenge on that particular subject - there really isn't a middle ground - regardless of which side of the argument you sit on.

Maybe we should take this over to the Brexit thread as many people were sold and voted for the 'of course we are not going to leave the customs union' Brexit that was repeatedly sold by the leave campaign

And it appears that where we now find ourselves, having to go through all EU import controls whilst not being able to implement any ourselves, breaking International Law on NIP and heading for a trade war, being a significant factor in our Inflationary problems, exporters going to the wall, shortages of staff across the NHS, Care homes, logistics etc etc is exactly the 'middle ground' you don't think exists (or as it used to be called 'the good deal')

 

[TomandJerry]

The chancellor says the PM wants him to be “completely honest” with the country and that there will be difficult decisions ahead.

He says he won’t specify which departments, but he will require “all departments”, including health, to make savings, and that some taxes will have to go up.

 

[WATFORD zero]

The chancellor says the PM wants him to be “completely honest” with the country and that there will be difficult decisions ahead.

He says he won’t specify which departments, but he will require “all departments”, including health, to make savings, and that some taxes will have to go up.

So not the complete opposite of Truss's election campaign

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

The chancellor says the PM wants him to be “completely honest” with the country and that there will be difficult decisions ahead.

He says he won’t specify which departments, but he will require “all departments”, including health, to make savings, and that some taxes will have to go up.

Truss has now realised Sunak was right and copying him.