JCLs to be upgraded

[McTavish]

Where do you live now ?

Sussex.

 

[alfredmizen]

Sussex.

Then I shouldn't need to tell you it should be england

 

[The Clamp]

Then I shouldn't need to tell you it should be england

Not sure you're qualified to dictate who should support who. You live in Sussex, support Chelsea, allegedly spent your life in London but spend your life on a BHA forum. Bit of a mess really. Each to their own but it's a bit rich, you telling people who they can support.

 

[BadFish]

Then I shouldn't need to tell you it should be england

So should I now support Australia?

 

[alfredmizen]

So should I now support Australia?

Why would you do that? You were born and brought up in England .

 

[BadFish]

Not sure you're qualified to dictate who should support who. You live in Sussex, support Chelsea, allegedly spent your life in London but spend your life on a BHA forum. Bit of a mess really. Each to their own but it's a bit rich, you telling people who they can support.

Yes but if he doesn't do it, who else is going to tell every one else how they should live their lives?

 

[Paul Reids Sock]

If I had called Mrs Earle 'my wide' when she was carrying our second child, I doubt I'd still be here to include it in a post on NSC!

Well to be fair, if the cap fits...

 

[GoingUp]

We could do with filling up the stadium, so more fans the merrier. More fans, more money.

 

[McTavish]

Then I shouldn't need to tell you it should be england

Why? You earlier said that people should support the country where they were born.

There is EVERYTHING wrong with a person born here supporting another team over England

 

[alfredmizen]

Why? You earlier said that people should support the country where they were born.

No i didnt , people should support the country where they were brought up , if you were in the US and your parents had a view towards settling there , then of course you should support the US , but they obviously didnt, i guess you were brought up in england , so you should support england , if youd been in the states much past 10 then youd probably regard yourself as american, there are no hard and fast rules (in my book) but be honest with me , do you think its a sign of a healthy cohesive society when 3rd and 4th generation pakistanis support that country over england ??

 

[BadFish]

No i didnt , people should support the country where they were brought up , if you were in the US and your parents had a view towards settling there , then of course you should support the US , but they obviously didnt, i guess you were brought up in england , so you should support england , if youd been in the states much past 10 then youd probably regard yourself as american, there are no hard and fast rules (in my book) but be honest with me , do you think its a sign of a healthy cohesive society when 3rd and 4th generation pakistanis support that country over england ??

Personally I don't think that what you describe is a sign of anything, positive or negative. It is just peoples persona choice or opinion. Many people in Australia still hold ties with the countries and cultures of their ancestry. I see no indication that these people are less cohesive members of society than those who only consider themselves as Australian.

 

[BadFish]

Double post

 

[McTavish]

No i didnt , people should support the country where they were brought up , if you were in the US and your parents had a view towards settling there , then of course you should support the US , but they obviously didnt, i guess you were brought up in england , so you should support england , if youd been in the states much past 10 then youd probably regard yourself as american, there are no hard and fast rules (in my book) but be honest with me , do you think its a sign of a healthy cohesive society when 3rd and 4th generation pakistanis support that country over england ??

I support Scotland; I have never lived there but, like many people, I support the same team as my dad and have tried to encourage my own children to support Scotland. When England play anyone apart from Scotland I support England despite the England football team being supported by a significant minority of violent, racist thugs when I was growing up and therefore representing everything that was wrong with England at that time.

I don't think that my support for Scotland has the slightest effect on the health and cohesion of the society in which I live and I think that it is unthinking and facile nationalism of the worst kind to suggest that just because someone doesn't automatically support the national team of the country where they were born/brought up/currently live (your "rules" on this seem to be unclear one minute there is "EVERYTHING wrong" with someone not supporting the national teams of their birth, the next there are "no hard and fast rules") that they are not committed to the success of the society and nation in which they live.

 

[BadFish]

I support Scotland; I have never lived there but, like many people, I support the same team as my dad and have tried to encourage my own children to support Scotland. When England play anyone apart from Scotland I support England despite the England football team being supported by a significant minority of violent, racist thugs when I was growing up and therefore representing everything that was wrong with England at that time.

I don't think that my support for Scotland has the slightest effect on the health and cohesion of the society in which I live and I think that it is unthinking and facile nationalism of the worst kind to suggest that just because someone doesn't automatically support the national team of the country where they were born/brought up/currently live (your "rules" on this seem to be unclear one minute there is "EVERYTHING wrong" with someone not supporting the national teams of their birth, the next there are "no hard and fast rules") that they are not committed to the success of the society and nation in which they live.

My boy was born and bought up in Australia and supports England (and Brighton). This tell me that i have been a larger influence on him than his surroundings and peers. Not much surprising here as i am his dad and in my opinion nothing to suggest that he will not be a cohesive and valuable member of the society he lives in when he grows up.

 

[alfredmizen]

I support Scotland; I have never lived there but, like many people, I support the same team as my dad and have tried to encourage my own children to support Scotland. When England play anyone apart from Scotland I support England despite the England football team being supported by a significant minority of violent, racist thugs when I was growing up and therefore representing everything that was wrong with England at that time.

I don't think that my support for Scotland has the slightest effect on the health and cohesion of the society in which I live and I think that it is unthinking and facile nationalism of the worst kind to suggest that just because someone doesn't automatically support the national team of the country where they were born/brought up/currently live (your "rules" on this seem to be unclear one minute there is "EVERYTHING wrong" with someone not supporting the national teams of their birth, the next there are "no hard and fast rules") that they are not committed to the success of the society and nation in which they live.

Well i think youre talking absolute rubbish and i think you realise the comparison youre attempting to make doesnt really stand up to any scrutiny,supporting another of the 'home' nations while living in the UK ( although a pathetic attempt to be 'different' in my book) is in no way similar to large swathes of people supporting a team thousands of miles away which in a lot of cases their GREAT grandparents came from .I sugggest its YOU who is unthinking in your determination for this country to be all things to all people.

 

[alfredmizen]

My boy was born and bought up in Australia and supports England (and Brighton). This tell me that i have been a larger influence on him than his surroundings and peers. Not much surprising here as i am his dad and in my opinion nothing to suggest that he will not be a cohesive and valuable member of the society he lives in when he grows up.

Brighton , fine , England , wrong, hes Australian , and id hazard a guess he'll change as he gets older , or he'll get a lot of stick.

 

[BadFish]

Brighton , fine , England , wrong, hes Australian , and id hazard a guess hell change as he gets older , or hell get a lot of stick.

Looking a bit more like hard and fast rules now.

Like I say many people hold links to their heritage. Nothing 'wrong' or unhealthy about it, just the way things are. You could be right though he may well change (althoug McTavish didn't so i can live in hope)...... And he will of course get stick, people get stick for all sorts down here it is very much part of the culture.

The point is though that what ever his choice, it will not have an effect either way on his role in which ever society he becomes part of. His choice will not make that society more or less cohesive.

I have spent the last couple of weeks discussing/bantering about the relative merits of Italian and English football with a 3rd generation Australian Italian fella (inter fan). Tonight we worked out that I had spent more time in Italy and have seen more Italian football than him so i am guessing the discussion may be at an end.

 

[McTavish]

Well i think youre talking absolute rubbish and i think you realise the comparison youre attempting to make doesnt really stand up to any scrutiny,supporting another of the 'home' nations while living in the UK ( although a pathetic attempt to be 'different' in my book) is in no way similar to large swathes of people supporting a team thousands of miles away which in a lot of cases their GREAT grandparents came from .I sugggest its YOU who is unthinking in your determination for this country to be all things to all people.

Pathetic because I support the same team as my Dad...oh well.

I think lots of people are able to have a slightly more nuanced approach to nationality than you would accept, all those self-proclaimed Irish-Americans or Irish-Germans who feel a deep and abiding connection with the country of their ancestors without being any less passionate about their support for the USA, or the children and grand-children of Italians who set up restaurants in this country in the 50s who still follow the Azzuri for example.

Which team you support in something as ultimately inconsequential as sport seems to be a very poor way to assess someone's contribution to society but a very handy blunt instrument with which to beat people who do not share your narrow world-view.

 

[alfredmizen]

Looking a bit more like hard and fast rules now.

Like I say many people hold links to their heritage. Nothing 'wrong' or unhealthy about it, just the way things are. You could be right though he may well change (althoug McTavish didn't so i can live in hope)...... And he will of course get stick, people get stick for all sorts down here it is very much part of the culture.

The point is though that what ever his choice, it will not have an effect either way on his role in which ever society he becomes part of. His choice will not make that society more or less cohesive.

I have spent the last couple of weeks discussing/bantering about the relative merits of Italian and English football with a 3rd generation Australian Italian fella (inter fan). Tonight we worked out that I had spent more time in Italy and have seen more Italian football than him so i am guessing the discussion may be at an end.

Apologies , i probably wasnt clear, the no hard and fast rules obviously in my book , applied to mctavish and other people born in one country but brought up in another since a young age , if youre born and brought up in one country then you should support it, end of story , social cohesion has sufffered in England as a result of the ridiculous pushing of multiculturalism, and australia will suffer too if clowns like you are allowed to push their milksop agendas , however the australia and aussies i know wont allow that to happen , i suspect youve already been put in your place a few times by aussies already, thats if you actually mix with any.

 

[BadFish]

Apologies , i probably wasnt clear, the no hard and fast rules obviously in my book , applied to mctavish and other people born in one country but brought up in another since a young age , if youre born and brought up in one country then you should support it, end of story , social cohesion has sufffered in England as a result of the ridiculous pushing of multiculturalism, and australia will suffer too if clowns like you are allowed to push their milksop agendas , however the australia and aussies i know wont allow that to happen , i suspect youve already been put in your place a few times by aussies already, thats if you actually mix with any.

Before you were suggesting that Social Cohesion has suffered because people support the wrong sports team. Now you seem to have reverted to the default of blaming your ills on multiculturalism. This is a subject we have done to death so i will bow out here before you lose your shit and start hurling insults about (too late for that obviously being a clown who doesn't mix with any Australians (even though in your book I live with 4 of them, end of story))