I knew Gove was a prat but .....

[The Large One]

i just think i was making a different point very badly. i dont know why the change is being made, there no debate only a auto-responce from a union. it may affect many negativly, is it good for the majority? is that good enough justification? dont know. Labour are supporting it, why is that? about the acedemies, they are sizable chunk of the number of schools and it would give us a view on how likely LEA schools would be to want to change their calander, thats all.

How can you say that?

Do you think that they oppose it just because it was a Tory government who announced it? Labour agree with the government, yet the union is still opposing it.

It's presumption on your part to think that it's an auto-response.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

There are two distinct ideas here which have been (unnecessarily, in my view) rolled into one.

1) Reducing/changing the amount of school holidays
2) Giving schools independence to set their own holidays

I think the first idea is perfectly legitimate and makes sense; I think 6 weeks for a summer holiday is OTT. The second makes absolutely no sense to me. I think it's wildly optimistic to expect holiday prices to come down; but it is clearly going to impact families where children go to different schools, and I really can't see any benefits. I'd go for more regulation of term dates, not less.

Regards point 1 - it's already expensive to go away within the current six weeks. Add in things like Scout camp across three children and there is no way it would work in anything less than six weeks. Remember that almost all companies won't allow all their staff off at the same time so you would be condensing a six week problem into four. Indeed, when I worked for Lloyds Bank you had to pick your main holiday at the beginning of the year - it was extremely difficult to enable all parents to get time during the six week summer holiday - reducing it would make it even more difficult.

 

[sten_super]

Regards point 1 - it's already expensive to go away within the current six weeks. Add in things like Scout camp across three children and there is no way it would work in anything less than six weeks. Remember that almost all companies won't allow all their staff off at the same time so you would be condensing a six week problem into four. Indeed, when I worked for Lloyds Bank you had to pick your main holiday at the beginning of the year - it was extremely difficult to enable all parents to get time during the six week summer holiday - reducing it would make it even more difficult.

A fair point that I hadn't really considered. I wonder to what degree the issue of taking holiday from work is a particularly British problem (at least within Europe); we work with a lot of European consultancies and a lot of them more or less shut down over the summer (in the sense that they ensure there are no pressing deadlines, for either us or them, over that period) to facilitate holidays. Realistically that would never happen in this country, but you wonder whether it would be more feasible over a 4 week break rather than a 6 week one.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

Any of you thinking that variable term times will have a beneficial impact on holiday prices are grossly mistaken.

All it will mean is that (for example) the one week period in February where prices are particularly expensive because it's half term will now become three weeks. The tour operators aren't going to start discounting your trips to Tuscany or Gran Canaria simply because your little treasures' hols are a week earlier than previously

 

[brightn'ove]

first class c*** hell bent on changing everything just for the sake of it. the twunt wants to make his mark, good or bad.

 

[jgmcdee]

Yet another stupid stupid idea out of our government. If they want to cut the school holidays a week or so then fine; not great, but I can understand that. But allowing schools to set their own term dates? Just horrible.

No doubt part of Gove's plan to get rid of LEAs altogether and give private companies free rein over our kids' education. Total disaster.

 

[sten_super]

No doubt part of Gove's plan to get rid of LEAs altogether and give private companies free rein over our kids' education. Total disaster.

This is absolutely what he's trying to do. He may be a thunderc*** of the highest order but you've got to give him his dues, he's an extremely pure ideological Tory, financial crisis be damned.

 

[Postman Pat]

I have always thought 6 weeks was too long for summer holidays, personally I would move the extra 2 weeks to xmas so kids were not walking to/from school at the darkest time of the year, would potentially reduce accidents.

I would also stagger the 4 week break across the country, i.e.

Scotland - Mid June - Mid July
North - First 4 weeks of July
Midlands - Mid July - Mid August
Wales - First 4 weeks of August
South - Mid August - Mid September.

Would then spread summer holidays across 4 months and would bring down the cost for parents, as prices couldn't stay that high for so long, and by overlapping the dates it would reduce the risk of one school being off when the other are in within neighbouring councils.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Any of you thinking that variable term times will have a beneficial impact on holiday prices are grossly mistaken.

All it will mean is that (for example) the one week period in February where prices are particularly expensive because it's half term will now become three weeks. The tour operators aren't going to start discounting your trips to Tuscany or Gran Canaria simply because your little treasures' hols are a week earlier than previously

You are wrong on that. Holidays are not discounted outside school holidays, they are normal price. They are raised to a premium for the school holidays. Currently Private schools already stagger many of their holidays and their families enjoy paying a normal price for holidays in half terms etc. - I know several people who actually equated this into the value of their school fees.

It may not effect the summer holiday period as much as this is a premium across Europe anyway, but it will mean more affordable prices for the smaller half term holidays - especially flights.

You've clearly never had to look at flights either side of a half term, whether you've got kids or not. The difference is dramatic. If 1 week for the majority is suddenly expanded to 3 or 4 weeks dividing the population up between those weeks, the tour operators / airlines will not have the concentrated demand like they have for a single week, therefore prices will return closer to normal.

 

[Normandy seagull]

I think I might buy one of these T-shirts

 

[Westdene Seagull]

A fair point that I hadn't really considered. I wonder to what degree the issue of taking holiday from work is a particularly British problem (at least within Europe); we work with a lot of European consultancies and a lot of them more or less shut down over the summer (in the sense that they ensure there are no pressing deadlines, for either us or them, over that period) to facilitate holidays. Realistically that would never happen in this country, but you wonder whether it would be more feasible over a 4 week break rather than a 6 week one.

Interesting point - I often go to France ( the Loire Valley as my parents have a home there ) and many businesses close down for a set period in which employees have to take their main holiday. I'm not opposed to that sort of idea just as long as the government imposes restrictions on holiday company prices - many French go on holiday within France so it's less of an issue for them.

 

[Bold Seagull]

In principle, I like the idea.

You could get round the issue of different kids in different schools by coordinating the holidays by Local Authority or Region.

It's a disgrace the premium you pay to go away in a half term break. In fact you try to do anything, like a theme park and the places are rammed.

A region agreeing different holiday dates from other regions does make good practical sense. I don't like the idea of individual schools having free license to do this, but some kind of LA or county wide dates I think would have all sorts of benefits, but to our own tourist industries that would have a longer spread of families on holiday, but also all sorts of leisure providers.

 

[Gwylan]

There are two distinct ideas here which have been (unnecessarily, in my view) rolled into one.
1) Reducing/changing the amount of school holidays

That bit's not true: Gove has said that the amount of holiday wouldn't alter - there's a statutory requirement that would need a law to change and he said he has no intention of changing it (yet).

So, state schools have to offer 39 weeks of teaching: that won't change, all that's being proposed is when they're taken.

 

[Eastleigh Seagull]

As a parent of a school age child i also think its a perfectly good idea as long as we are informed a couple of years in advance when the term dates are then we can plan accordingly.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

As a parent of a school age child i also think its a perfectly good idea as long as we are informed a couple of years in advance when the term dates are then we can plan accordingly.

What if you had more than one child, they were in different schools and each school had different holiday dates ? Would you be in favour then ?

 

[Billy the Fish]

Why is anyone even mentioning the price of holidays? That is surely a smokescreen by the union, there must be more important things to take into account. The tour operators will always find a way to ensure maximum profit whatever school holiday dates are set, that is their job.

Surely this could be of benefit to business if every employee with children isn't fighting to take annual leave in the same period.

 

[Bold Seagull]

What if you had more than one child, they were in different schools and each school had different holiday dates ? Would you be in favour then ?

This could be addressed if the dates were agreed across a local authority or region. I don't agree individual schools should be able to set dates, but say a county, or region, or local authority set a pattern of dates that schools, whether state, free or otherwise signed up to, it would get round the issue of kids from the same family in different schools.

 

[7:18]

I think I might buy one of these T-shirts
View attachment 44372

LOVE THAT!

 

[Bold Seagull]

Why is anyone even mentioning the price of holidays? That is surely a smokescreen by the union, there must be more important things to take into account. The tour operators will always find a way to ensure maximum profit whatever school holiday dates are set, that is their job.

Surely this could be of benefit to business if every employee with children isn't fighting to take annual leave in the same period.

I think there could be many benefits, including to our economy. Whether leisure providers, holidays, destinations, etc. could all see their busy times extended by staggered dates.

 

[sten_super]

That bit's not true: Gove has said that the amount of holiday wouldn't alter - there's a statutory requirement that would need a law to change and he said he has no intention of changing it (yet).

So, state schools have to offer 39 weeks of teaching: that won't change, all that's being proposed is when they're taken.

The news reports I've read state that schools will still be bound to offer a minimum of 190 days of term time; however it might well be the case that they aren't able to increase term length either (I don't know).