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Has George Bush actually got something right?



Gilliver's Travels

Peripatetic
Jul 5, 2003
2,926
Brighton Marina Village
Interestingly, he called the would-be plane bombers "Islamic Fascists".

Not his usual loaded language, like "Terrorists", or "Evil Doers", or "Freedom Haters", or members of the "Axis of Evil"...

So, they are "Islamic Fascists". Yes?
 




Grendel

New member
Jul 28, 2005
3,251
Seaford
Not really. I don't see how he can attach an entire political philosophy to an effectively unknown group of people, of whom he knows little or nothing or their political beliefs.
 


hans kraay fan club

The voice of reason.
Helpful Moderator
Mar 16, 2005
63,084
Chandlers Ford
Grendel said:
Not really. I don't see how he can attach an entire political philosophy to an effectively unknown group of people, of whom he knows little or nothing or their political beliefs.

Fascism is the unwillingness to accept any other idealogies other than ones own, so yes I think it would be fair to bracket Islamic Fundamentalists as such. Personally, I think they should drop the 'Funda' part, and just go with 'Mentalists'
 


Grendel

New member
Jul 28, 2005
3,251
Seaford
hans kraay fan club said:
Fascism is the unwillingness to accept any other idealogies other than ones own

That's a trait of Fascism, not a definition of Fascism itself. Fascism is an entire socio-economic philosophy incorporating elements of Capitalism, Nationalism, Socialism and Totalitarianism. To label terrorists as Fascists is simplistic, to say the least.
 


Uncle Spielberg

Well-known member
Jul 6, 2003
43,452
Lancing
I like to refer to them as

C*NTS
 




Gilliver's Travels

Peripatetic
Jul 5, 2003
2,926
Brighton Marina Village
Grendel said:
That's a trait of Fascism, not a definition of Fascism itself. Fascism is an entire socio-economic philosophy incorporating elements of Capitalism, Nationalism, Socialism and Totalitarianism. To label terrorists as Fascists is simplistic, to say the least.
Know what you mean, but without the capital F, fascism has a secondary definition as an unbending authoritarianism that will accept no challenge, that will punish or even murder those who disagree with its tenets. Sharia authorises the murder of apostates, for example.

To that extent, this latest, less Manichean, Bush expression is harder hitting and more appropriate than previous ramblings.
 


hans kraay fan club

The voice of reason.
Helpful Moderator
Mar 16, 2005
63,084
Chandlers Ford
Gilliver's Travels said:
Know what you mean, but without the capital F, fascism has a secondary definition as an unbending authoritarianism that will accept no challenge, that will punish or even murder those who disagree with its tenets. Sharia authorises the murder of apostates, for example.

To that extent, this latest, less Manichean, Bush expression is harder hitting and more appropriate than previous ramblings.

My point exactly. Sorry about the big 'F'. It was only because it was the start of the sentence!

Still prefer 'Mentalists' btw.
 


Grendel

New member
Jul 28, 2005
3,251
Seaford
Gilliver's Travels said:
To that extent, this latest, less Manichean, Bush expression is harder hitting and more appropriate than previous ramblings.

And there, I believe, you have hit the nail on the head. Without discussing the ins, outs, rights and wrongs of what Bush said, the important thing, as far as he is concerned, is that he has an impact on Joe Public's mindset. I doubt his thinking went much beyond "Fascists are bad. Muslimist tourists are bad, therefore they must be fascists." but millions of people listening to, or reading what he said are going to pay attention to it and think "shit, we must stop these fascist bastards".

Besides which, "freedom hater" just sounds a bit gay.
 






Trufflehound

Re-enfranchised
Aug 5, 2003
14,131
The democratic and free EU
The Boss said:
Talking of "Fascists", did Hitler really only have one trouser balloon?

Yes. The other one is kept in a safe place in the Albert Hall.

But apparently Goebbels had none at all... So I've heard.
 


Grendel said:
That's a trait of Fascism, not a definition of Fascism itself. Fascism is an entire socio-economic philosophy incorporating elements of Capitalism, Nationalism, Socialism and Totalitarianism. To label terrorists as Fascists is simplistic, to say the least.

Agreed - there is no doubt that the extreme Islamic fundamentalists share some traits and beliefs with the Hitler's and Mussolini's of history, but then with his propensity to invade countries, bomb the hell out of them and cause staggering loss of life, so does George W Bush. So on that criteria, it would be perfectly acceptable for me to refer to him as a Republican Fascist. Not very scientific for me to do so I think, but no worse than the kind of lazy thinking that Dubya and the American right engage in.
 
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Lammy

Registered Abuser
Oct 1, 2003
7,581
Newhaven/Lewes/Atlanta
Going on from what hans kraay apart from there being little or no publicity (which is what I'd much rather see) I think they should use much more soppy titles for them.

First of all I wouldn't refer to them as Islamic. The IRA were rarely if ever refered to as Catholic fundamentalists!

So I'd drop that straight away. I'd then use a much less HARD name like 'wally' or 'silly billy'

Police today have arrested 24 silly billies for attempting to be VERY naughty at Gatwick.
 


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