[Cricket] *** England v West Indies, Lords, 1st Test. Farewell to Sir Jimmy Anderson ***

[Eeyore]

All really spot on here. The answer is money of course. And unless there is a fairer distribution of it in test cricket then the game will be doomed to fail (or at least, be a smaller symbolic competition between 4 teams).

The World Test Championship was the right first step, but its implementation has been dreadful. It should have standardised the game, instead it has just shown it up to be an uneven calendar, with a league table that is somewhat warped (on purpose) by the biggest player.

Regarding the ticket prices, £195 was for the upper tier of the Grand Stand. For Sri Lanka that's £140 each with no deductions for Under 16s. The cheapest ticket for that, (not including restricted view or alcohol free zone) is £115 for adults and £40 for U16. That's £310 for a family of 4 to see England trounce sub-standard opposition. As someone who grew up as a Middlesex Colt, and now lives within a ten minute walk from Lords, this is the first year where I've found myself unable to afford a ticket and I find that really sad. It can't be sustainable for the game.

That's pure urine extraction. Birmingham is £65 for a decent seat and £15 for kids. First two days for Windies almost sold out.

Must be a Lords thing.

 

[amexer]

All really spot on here. The answer is money of course. And unless there is a fairer distribution of it in test cricket then the game will be doomed to fail (or at least, be a smaller symbolic competition between 4 teams).

The World Test Championship was the right first step, but its implementation has been dreadful. It should have standardised the game, instead it has just shown it up to be an uneven calendar, with a league table that is somewhat warped (on purpose) by the biggest player.

Regarding the ticket prices, £195 was for the upper tier of the Grand Stand. For Sri Lanka that's £140 each with no deductions for Under 16s. The cheapest ticket for that, (not including restricted view or alcohol free zone) is £115 for adults and £40 for U16. That's £310 for a family of 4 to see England trounce sub-standard opposition. As someone who grew up as a Middlesex Colt, and now lives within a ten minute walk from Lords, this is the first year where I've found myself unable to afford a ticket and I find that really sad. It can't be sustainable for the game.

Money is a big thing but many other issues. 1) No marketing at all of County Cricket. ( I recieve dozens of texts/emails about 20/20 games from Sussex but nothing about championship games) 2) most games are in April,May and September. Therefore few there because who wants to watch cricket in overcoat. 3) Very rarely see the top players. Many miss part of season because they are playing in overseas competitions. 20/20 has also seen the end of a great 50 over competition we had as priority given to the mad Hundred.. Now a 2nd team competition Final now taken away from Lords
just doesnt seem long ago I took days of work to see Holding Richards Warne etc play at County ground. It must be one of only sports in UK where top level club standard has gone down and down

 

[Beanstalk]

That's pure urine extraction. Birmingham is £65 for a decent seat and £15 for kids. First two days for Windies almost sold out.

Must be a Lords thing.

Yep. Lords prices have gone up extraordinarily this year across the board and with no chance of either test making it to day 5, there's little opportunity to get there. And in fairness, it sells out - just prices out people like me (who, as a fully employed Londoner, it really shouldn't).

I did manage to get to see one of the greatest days of test cricket on day 5 of the Lords Ashes test last year for something like £15 but there is no chance of that this summer with such poor opposition.

 

[Beanstalk]

Money is a big thing but many other issues. 1) No marketing at all of County Cricket. ( I recieve dozens of texts/emails about 20/20 games from Sussex but nothing about championship games) 2) most games are in April,May and September. Therefore few there because who wants to watch cricket in overcoat. 3) Very rarely see the top players. Many miss part of season because they are playing in overseas competitions. 20/20 has also seen the end of a great 50 over competition we had as priority given to the mad Hundred.. Now a 2nd team competition Final now taken away from Lords
just doesnt seem long ago I took days of work to see Holding Richards Warne etc play at County ground. It must be one of only sports in UK where top level club standard has gone down and down

I mean this genuinely, but what has the marketing of County Cricket got to do with the downfall of the West Indies Test team?

My response about money being the answer was about the dreadful drop off of the West Indies. Unless you get enough money into the Test playing nations that aren't India, Australia and England, they'll never be a viable force in the game. That can be said for loads of other historic test playing nations as well.

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

I'd put Bob Willis just above Jimmy for England. Interesting that their figures are pretty close excepting that Bob played 90 Tests.

You say their figures are pretty close, Anderson's last 325wickets (Willis' total) were at well under 23.

He just happened to have taken another 375 first (at almost exactly 30, for what it's worth).

I think I'm right in saying that Willis' average, and presumably by extension all other bowlers up until whenever this changed, doesn't include his no ball total, which is apparently a somewhat ludicrous 941. If that's added on then his average rises to just over 28.*

*I found the article I read this in, it's buried in the stats bit near the bottom of the article: https://www.skysports.com/cricket/n...forbob-day-and-inducted-into-icc-hall-of-fame

Both great bowlers, obviously. I don't want to come across as though I'm doing Willis down.

 

[Eeyore]

I mean this genuinely, but what has the marketing of County Cricket got to do with the downfall of the West Indies Test team?

My response about money being the answer was about the dreadful drop off of the West Indies. Unless you get enough money into the Test playing nations that aren't India, Australia and England, they'll never be a viable force in the game. That can be said for loads of other historic test playing nations as well.

One of the problems that can be used in mitigation is that teams don't seem to travel well these days. We haven't won any of the last four series over there. That said, the recent drop in Windies standard at Test level is a huge worry.

 

[Eeyore]

You say their figures are pretty close, Anderson's last 325wickets (Willis' total) were at well under 23.

He just happened to have taken another 375 first (at almost exactly 30, for what it's worth).

I think I'm right in saying that Willis' average, and presumably by extension all other bowlers up until whenever this changed, doesn't include his no ball total, which is apparently a somewhat ludicrous 941. If that's added on then his average rises to just over 28.*

*I found the article I read this in, it's buried in the stats bit near the bottom of the article: https://www.skysports.com/cricket/n...forbob-day-and-inducted-into-icc-hall-of-fame

Both great bowlers, obviously. I don't want to come across as though I'm doing Willis down.

I wouldn't consider no balls as bowlers back then didn't really have them in their psychology as much.

Bob was always my hero as a youngster and the reason why I became a quicky (that and not being able to co-ordinate hand eye with the bat despite being able to play any shot in my bedroom). Ironically, I can't remember ever bowling a no ball step over. He was a fearsome sight and even more so when you consider the pain barrier with those dodgy knees. I had a love for Graham Dilley too, also plagued by injury, and also sadly departed as well. Never understood how his foot didn't break with that unusual drag he had.

I'm not sure there will be another Jimmy. All the talk of Atkinson who, for me, just doesn't have that something about him. English pace bowlers just don't seem to have that control these days.

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

I wouldn't consider no balls as bowlers back then didn't really have them in their psychology as much.

Bob was always my hero as a youngster and the reason why I became a quicky (that and not being able to co-ordinate hand eye with the bat despite being able to play any shot in my bedroom). Ironically, I can't remember ever bowling a no ball step over. He was a fearsome sight and even more so when you consider the pain barrier with those dodgy knees. I had a love for Graham Dilley too, also plagued by injury, and also sadly departed as well. Never understood how his foot didn't break with that unusual drag he had.

I'm not sure there will be another Jimmy. All the talk of Atkinson who, for me, just doesn't have that something about him. English pace bowlers just don't seem to have that control these days.

It's not the sort of thing I'd normally get hung up on, but even by the standards of the time he did bowl an awful lot of No balls. As an aside, apparently it was well into the 90s before Benaud stopped moaning about the front foot no ball rule ruining the game on commentary in Australia (I heard this from an Australian, no idea if he also did this while working for the BBC).

I don't see Atkinson being anywhere near the bowler Anderson has been, mainly because I can't see anybody being that good. It's easy to forget now that Anderson was pretty much as quick as Atkinson is now when he started. And he'd played a lot more than 20 first class matches by the time he was 26.

I'd like to see Atkinson try and swing the ball, even if the wobble seamer was the right ball for the pitch for most of the time.

 

[Eeyore]

Just realised that Bashir didn't bowl a single ball in this match.

 

[Luke93]

Anderson should’ve got the whole summer to retire in style. One token game after 21 years of service feels wrong on an emotional level after the sacrifices he gave.

But logically you can argue he should still be playing. Easily the best seam bowler in India over the winter (they had to just blunt him out). England stated this series 9th in the Test Championship and should be picking their strongest side.

I like having an eye on the future but the squad of 15+ and playing 11 has room for Anderson and development slots. Who knows in 18 months time who our starting bowlers will be, form, injuries and playing conditions on the day make it impossible to predict.

Woakes is 35 and goes against their own philosophy that forced Anderson out. We already know how ineffective he is in Australia and isn’t likely to change. I’d also argue the ideal scenario to blood the likes of Atkinson and Pennington is a whole summer playing with Anderson, part of the drawing room, seeing how he conducts himself on and off the pitch as the perfect example. Anderson in recent years is still lowering career average but doing so with a ridiculously low economy rate, the ideal bowling partner to have.

 

[Ooh it’s a corner]

Just realised that Bashir didn't bowl a single ball in this match.

I’m not sure he troubled the scorer with bat either did he? Not needed

 

[fly high]

I mean this genuinely, but what has the marketing of County Cricket got to do with the downfall of the West Indies Test team?

My response about money being the answer was about the dreadful drop off of the West Indies. Unless you get enough money into the Test playing nations that aren't India, Australia and England, they'll never be a viable force in the game. That can be said for loads of other historic test playing nations as well.

Youngsters in the Windies are more interested in playing basketball or football. You don't have kids setting up pitches on any area of open ground any more. Those who do play and get good at cricket just want to play T20, that is where the money is. You can play T20 nearly all year round, even the USA has it now.

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

I’m not sure he troubled the scorer with bat either did he? Not needed

Could be worse. At least he actually got out in the middle and faced a few balls.

Adil Rashid played in a test match at Lord's a few years ago in which he didn't bat at all, bowl in either innings, or take a catch.

I'd take that as a test career if it was offered to me.

 

[fly high]

Anderson should’ve got the whole summer to retire in style. One token game after 21 years of service feels wrong on an emotional level after the sacrifices he gave.

But logically you can argue he should still be playing. Easily the best seam bowler in India over the winter (they had to just blunt him out). England stated this series 9th in the Test Championship and should be picking their strongest side.

I like having an eye on the future but the squad of 15+ and playing 11 has room for Anderson and development slots. Who knows in 18 months time who our starting bowlers will be, form, injuries and playing conditions on the day make it impossible to predict.

Woakes is 35 and goes against their own philosophy that forced Anderson out. We already know how ineffective he is in Australia and isn’t likely to change. I’d also argue the ideal scenario to blood the likes of Atkinson and Pennington is a whole summer playing with Anderson, part of the drawing room, seeing how he conducts himself on and off the pitch as the perfect example. Anderson in recent years is still lowering career average but doing so with a ridiculously low economy rate, the ideal bowling partner to have.

Plus Anderson should have been given the opportunity to get past Shane Warne. Just 4 behind him after this test.

 

[Sussexscots]

Anderson should’ve got the whole summer to retire in style. One token game after 21 years of service feels wrong on an emotional level after the sacrifices he gave.

But logically you can argue he should still be playing. Easily the best seam bowler in India over the winter (they had to just blunt him out). England stated this series 9th in the Test Championship and should be picking their strongest side.

I like having an eye on the future but the squad of 15+ and playing 11 has room for Anderson and development slots. Who knows in 18 months time who our starting bowlers will be, form, injuries and playing conditions on the day make it impossible to predict.

Woakes is 35 and goes against their own philosophy that forced Anderson out. We already know how ineffective he is in Australia and isn’t likely to change. I’d also argue the ideal scenario to blood the likes of Atkinson and Pennington is a whole summer playing with Anderson, part of the drawing room, seeing how he conducts himself on and off the pitch as the perfect example. Anderson in recent years is still lowering career average but doing so with a ridiculously low economy rate, the ideal bowling partner to have.

Agree. Still merits his place.

At the very least, I think he should have had his final test at Old Trafford and an opportunity to overtake Shane Warne.

 

[Beanstalk]

Anderson should’ve got the whole summer to retire in style. One token game after 21 years of service feels wrong on an emotional level after the sacrifices he gave.

But logically you can argue he should still be playing. Easily the best seam bowler in India over the winter (they had to just blunt him out). England stated this series 9th in the Test Championship and should be picking their strongest side.

I like having an eye on the future but the squad of 15+ and playing 11 has room for Anderson and development slots. Who knows in 18 months time who our starting bowlers will be, form, injuries and playing conditions on the day make it impossible to predict.

Woakes is 35 and goes against their own philosophy that forced Anderson out. We already know how ineffective he is in Australia and isn’t likely to change. I’d also argue the ideal scenario to blood the likes of Atkinson and Pennington is a whole summer playing with Anderson, part of the drawing room, seeing how he conducts himself on and off the pitch as the perfect example. Anderson in recent years is still lowering career average but doing so with a ridiculously low economy rate, the ideal bowling partner to have.

I personally think he should've been given the summer as a farewell tour for emotional reasons but then I guess the argument is that he's not only not going to make Australia in 25/26 but he's also not going to make Pakistan and New Zealand this winter so why not bring different bowlers in as part of this English test summer where the opposition aren't good enough to mount a real challenge and they can be bedded in properly ahead of a more difficult winter.

And by all accounts if it was solely up to him, he'd never stop, so I think this was probably a gentle way of saying "have a blow Jimmy". It's a very nicely managed exit that gave him his moment of adoration. The alternative was to just stop selecting him which would've been horrific (see Beckham and McClaren). He's also staying with the team for the rest of the summer as a bowling mentor so Atkinson and Pennington will get that experience from him.

 

[amexer]

I mean this genuinely, but what has the marketing of County Cricket got to do with the downfall of the West Indies Test team?

My response about money being the answer was about the dreadful drop off of the West Indies. Unless you get enough money into the Test playing nations that aren't India, Australia and England, they'll never be a viable force in the game. That can be said for loads of other historic test playing nations as well.

I was talking in general about 20/20 and mentioned County cricket because of how the quality has gone down because of it.
As far as WIs is concerned would think 20/20 is biggest reason test side is down the pan. At least in England players that only play county game still earn a living which is unlikely at samr level in WIs. Over last few years there best players have refused to play test matches and only play in 20/20 games round the world. A good example is Hope an outstanding batter that put 20/20 games before this tour

 

[A1X]

Fabulous day, and we got onto the outfield after play

And thanks to the MCC refund policy, it was all for free! Cheers Gus!

 

[Pevenseagull]

Just realised that Bashir didn't bowl a single ball in this match.

He was born about 4 months after Anderson's first test cap.

His mum probably had 2 periods before he was conceived when Anderson made his international debut.


Yes, I am weird.

 

[Eeyore]

He was born about 4 months after Anderson's first test cap.

His mum probably had 2 periods before he was conceived when Anderson made his international debut.


Yes, I am weird.

Yeah, that analogy started off well then went a bit weird