[News] COP 28

[The Clamp]

Does anybody actually believe life on earth can survive much longer at this rate?

We are beyond repair.

 

[nicko31]

Does anybody actually believe life on earth can survive much longer at this rate?

We are beyond repair.

The problem is have is vested interests from disingenuous petro states, to lobby groups maskerading as think tanks, to leaders in the pockets of big oil.

Here the climate deniers have changed tack, flat denial won't wash now so its over to its too expensive to act and China this, India that....

 

[Barry Izbak]

I know a guy who is out there working as a cameraman.
Four weeks of fabulous hotel accommodation and top dollar expenses in addition to extraordinary pay for hundreds of people in addition to the actual delegates.

Nice work if you can get it

 

[nicko31]

I know a guy who is out there working as a cameraman.
Four weeks of fabulous hotel accommodation and top dollar expenses in addition to extraordinary pay for hundreds of people in addition to the actual delegates.

Nice work if you can get it

Surprised they didn't put him in one of the locally run low impact eco lodges that the UAE is renowned for

 

[beorhthelm]

I know a guy who is out there working as a cameraman.
Four weeks of fabulous hotel accommodation and top dollar expenses in addition to extraordinary pay for hundreds of people in addition to the actual delegates.

Nice work if you can get it

i read there were near 100k delegates. dont know it that accounts for the media and other entourage. nearly all would have flown in. until they are doing these things by Zoom, i dont think they are that serious.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Whose idea was to hold a climate summit in the epicentre of petrol production?

The level of sincerity coming out of Qatar is approximately the same as you would get from a former government minister apologising for their handling of Covid.

 

[The Fits]

Does anybody actually believe life on earth can survive much longer at this rate?

We are beyond repair.

Yup too little too late and things like COP feels like a charade especially given this years host. It’s nearly 2024. We’ve had years, decades, to get a real hold of this and we’ve all just sat on our hands. All of us, I’m afraid.
Earth will be alright, she’ll keep turning.

 

[Trufflehound]

I went to COP 6 back in 2000. The general consensus back then - among the non-politician and non-political-lobbyist attendees at any rate - was that it was all hot air, and too little too late.

23 years on and the hot air just keeps getting hotter, and it just keeps getting too later, and nothing else changes.

The only thing they'll agree (that will actually get implemented) is to meet again next year at another vastly expensive jolly...

 

[Machiavelli]

Does anybody actually believe life on earth can survive much longer at this rate?

We are beyond repair.

The one guaranteed route to us being 'beyond repair' is to assume that 'we' are beyond repair. You seem to be of the view that 'hell is other people' (or, 'beyond repair is other people').
There's a clear consensus around tackling the climate crisis and doing so in a rapid timescale, and at both global and national levels. That is yet to be translated into policy and, without continued public pressure, that will remain the case.

 

[The Clamp]

The one guaranteed route to us being 'beyond repair' is to assume that 'we' are beyond repair. You seem to be of the view that 'hell is other people' (or, 'beyond repair is other people').
There's a clear consensus around tackling the climate crisis and doing so in a rapid timescale, and at both global and national levels. That is yet to be translated into policy and, without continued public pressure, that will remain the case.

Not “other people” , all people.

The best thing for earth and the life we haven’t managed to wipe out is for humans to become extinct.

 

[nicko31]

I went to COP 6 back in 2000. The general consensus back then - among the non-politician and non-political-lobbyist attendees at any rate - was that it was all hot air, and too little too late.

23 years on and the hot air just keeps getting hotter, and it just keeps getting too later, and nothing else changes.

The only thing they'll agree (that will actually get implemented) is to meet again next year at another vastly expensive jolly...

I remember Rio 92 which was an epic fail, 30 years on and vested interests at still at it. Just dumb with all the advancements in the past century we're still addicted to single use fuels

God help us if Trump gets in again.

 

[JBizzle]

God help us if Trump gets in again.

Sadly, I think it's "when" rather than "if"

 

[Hamilton]

First, we're coming to this too late.

That said, we do have the resources and know-how to do something about but.

But, we must not look at this through Western eyes. Each year, new populations are emancipated through health, education and technology. It's estimated that 300,000,000 people in Asia will see the quality of their life enhanced in the coming years. With that comes higher expectations for their quality fo life - that inevitably brings with it a demand for energy. Are we to deny them that without giving something up?

Take a look at the Netherlands. Its population is one of the greenest when it comes to car usage.

Now look at the Sehal and countries booming in Africa. Many of them have some of the largest markets for second hand cars. This transport is changing peoples lives. Where are those cars coming from? The Netherlands is the biggest exporter (per head) of second hand cars to Africa.

Do we stop exporting cars and destroy them? What right do we have to prevent people from having a better quality of life.

Right now, even if we wanted to turn all the oil and gas off we simply don't have the infrastructure in place to get wind, solar and tidal power to people. Right now we don't yet have the pipework in place that can prevent the much smaller gas molecules from escaping through pipe membranes and into the atmosphere. So, unless we are all going to turn the lights off, we need oil and gas.

But it must be cleaner. We need to capture the carbon. We need to refine the product differently. And we do not need to approve new oil and gas fields. Greta Thunberg and the Head of the International Energy Authority recently shared a platform and they were agreed on this. We can transition faster.

We also have to accelerate biofuels and the roll-out of alternatives and twice the rate we're currently going at.

The CEO of Shell recently said that the energy sector was capitalist. It goes where the money goes. He has asked for Carbon taxes. Without them, the energy sector will do what shareholders want - make money. And if a leadership team steps in to drive a transition to alternative fuels without including fossil fuels, then right now it would just be ousted by shareholders.

As to COP, we do risk it being hijacked by unscrupulous players. That said, there's a reason why this COP is in the Middle East. Saudi Arabia and the UAE know that their days are numbered. The world will transition to alternatives and their oil will be useless. They want to be in control of that new world. They want to be accepted global players culturally and economically. They will lead in Solar power. It's why they are interested in the geo-politics of Mali, Niger and the Democratic Republic of Congo, because that's where the minerals are that we'll need for many of the technologies we will need. They're watching what China and the USA do in that region with interest.

I've worked for an Oil & Gas/Energy company for many years (one of the big operators), and I certainly feel there is more they can do. I'm not satisfied. But I also have some reasons for optimism.

Thirty years ago I also worked for a brand that was dedicated to environmentalism. Back then we were shouting about this stuff alone, and being laughed at a belittled.

Now, the conversation has changed, and the ability is there. The challenge is far bigger than I think anyone even realises, but I think we can rescue victory from the jaws of defeat, but only if we keep our eyes open, keep changing our own behaviour, keep supporting those brave environmental suffragettes prepared to get arrested for the cause, and keep the pressure on our elected MPs.

That's my diatribe on the subject. All's not lost (yet.)

 

[Machiavelli]

First, we're coming to this too late.

That said, we do have the resources and know-how to do something about but.

But, we must not look at this through Western eyes. Each year, new populations are emancipated through health, education and technology. It's estimated that 300,000,000 people in Asia will see the quality of their life enhanced in the coming years. With that comes higher expectations for their quality fo life - that inevitably brings with it a demand for energy. Are we to deny them that without giving something up?

Take a look at the Netherlands. Its population is one of the greenest when it comes to car usage.

Now look at the Sehal and countries booming in Africa. Many of them have some of the largest markets for second hand cars. This transport is changing peoples lives. Where are those cars coming from? The Netherlands is the biggest exporter (per head) of second hand cars to Africa.

Do we stop exporting cars and destroy them? What right do we have to prevent people from having a better quality of life.

Right now, even if we wanted to turn all the oil and gas off we simply don't have the infrastructure in place to get wind, solar and tidal power to people. Right now we don't yet have the pipework in place that can prevent the much smaller gas molecules from escaping through pipe membranes and into the atmosphere. So, unless we are all going to turn the lights off, we need oil and gas.

But it must be cleaner. We need to capture the carbon. We need to refine the product differently. And we do not need to approve new oil and gas fields. Greta Thunberg and the Head of the International Energy Authority recently shared a platform and they were agreed on this. We can transition faster.

We also have to accelerate biofuels and the roll-out of alternatives and twice the rate we're currently going at.

The CEO of Shell recently said that the energy sector was capitalist. It goes where the money goes. He has asked for Carbon taxes. Without them, the energy sector will do what shareholders want - make money. And if a leadership team steps in to drive a transition to alternative fuels without including fossil fuels, then right now it would just be ousted by shareholders.

As to COP, we do risk it being hijacked by unscrupulous players. That said, there's a reason why this COP is in the Middle East. Saudi Arabia and the UAE know that their days are numbered. The world will transition to alternatives and their oil will be useless. They want to be in control of that new world. They want to be accepted global players culturally and economically. They will lead in Solar power. It's why they are interested in the geo-politics of Mali, Niger and the Democratic Republic of Congo, because that's where the minerals are that we'll need for many of the technologies we will need. They're watching what China and the USA do in that region with interest.

I've worked for an Oil & Gas/Energy company for many years (one of the big operators), and I certainly feel there is more they can do. I'm not satisfied. But I also have some reasons for optimism.

Thirty years ago I also worked for a brand that was dedicated to environmentalism. Back then we were shouting about this stuff alone, and being laughed at a belittled.

Now, the conversation has changed, and the ability is there. The challenge is far bigger than I think anyone even realises, but I think we can rescue victory from the jaws of defeat, but only if we keep our eyes open, keep changing our own behaviour, keep supporting those brave environmental suffragettes prepared to get arrested for the cause, and keep the pressure on our elected MPs.

That's my diatribe on the subject. All's not lost (yet.)

Great post. I'd exercise caution on CCS, because we don't know the cost, problems of scaling it up enormously but, apart from that, agree with most of your suggestions. On your car example, most of the energy involved is sunk in the production, so exporting from an affluent country to one that is emerging is a way around this. Carbon taxes need to be introduced yesterday. And thank you for aligning JSO etc with the suffragettes.
For all the cynicism about CoP (and this one in particular, given the role of the UAE), this one seems as though it's producing some quite radical announcements: on methane, on tripling renewables by 2030 and, potentially, on phasing out fossil fuels.
All is not lost, but there will be some significant changes to policy and lifestyles. Despite such significance, none of this needs to be negative.

 

[nicko31]

I see the COP 28 Loss and Damage Fund has around $400m pledged

The USA is the country with the biggest carbon debt by a mile is contributing $17m, a crime in itself