[Finance] Cash or card ?

[Creaky]

I'm no financial wizard so don't really understand how the value of cash is assessed other than by the level of confidence in the pound.

However when I use a Bank of England note I do know it has a real value which is linked to a real institution.

When I spend electronically then what is the value of that spend? Who is guaranteeing the value, what is the source of that value and am I actually shoring up the economy of the UK or that of another country?

 

[beorhthelm]

I'm no financial wizard so don't really understand how the value of cash is assessed other than by the level of confidence in the pound.

However when I use a Bank of England note I do know it has a real value which is linked to a real institution.

When I spend electronically then what is the value of that spend? Who is guaranteeing the value, what is the source of that value and am I actually shoring up the economy of the UK or that of another country?

its an intriguing question, one i dont find has a satisfactory answer (end up in circular referencing). at a high level there is an amount of money and this cycles round the economy, giving us number for total value, GDP. we already have far more money than represented in cash notes going round the economy. so going cashless doesnt necessarily make any difference, we're already mostly running on virtual money.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

i just feel if we lose cash completely then banks and financial institutions and governments have full control , turn off the internet or electricity and you don't have access to your money , majority of the payments i take are eft .....humans have used cash for thousands of years , why change it ...? my wife went OS before christmas and got her credit card skimmed , what a ball ache.

The banks and financial institutions and governments have full control anyway regardless of whether the payment is made with physical money or electronically. It’s still “money” regardless of the form.

 

[Creaky]

The banks and financial institutions and governments have full control anyway regardless of whether the payment is made with physical money or electronically. It’s still “money” regardless of the form.

This is the bit I don't understand - with cash there is a finite supply, until the Bank of England prints more which can then alter the overseas value of the pound.

With digital money what is the money supply. If I bank with a Spanish bank for instance whilst all the transactions may be designated and calculated as Sterling are these transactions part of the overall UK reserves, (probably the wrong word?), or are they backed by investments/reserves held overseas.

Do the multi-national banks have separate investments, reserves and accounts for each country they operate in?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

This is the bit I don't understand - with cash there is a finite supply, until the Bank of England prints more which can then alter the overseas value of the pound.

With digital money what is the money supply. If I bank with a Spanish bank for instance whilst all the transactions may be designated and calculated as Sterling are these transactions part of the overall UK reserves, (probably the wrong word?), or are they backed by investments/reserves held overseas.

Do the multi-national banks have separate investments, reserves and accounts for each country they operate in?

I’m afraid I don’t know the answer to this; it’s an interesting question though. My point was that if I pay someone 100 quid by card, or cash, it’s the same 100 quid from my bank account.

 

[sydney]

The banks and financial institutions and governments have full control anyway regardless of whether the payment is made with physical money or electronically. It’s still “money” regardless of the form.

only to a degree , i have to say the entire control issue gets on my nerves big time , until not too long ago marijuana was an insidious drug sending people mad and ruining lives , you could be put in jail for repeated possession , now its a lifesaver and you can get it from your doctor , it's all about money and control, protecting the economy and shutting down the black money/cash economy imho. i don't do control i'm afraid , never have. I will continue to use cash whenever and wherever possible and will avoid cashless providers.

 

[HastingsSeagull]

Cash and Phone apps for the last 10-12 years (UK debit card only for online). Sweden, Hong Kong, Mainland China and then Philippines have all been using QR codes and phone apps for years and pre-covid it always felt UK was a bit behind. To me cards are the thing that's doomed and it's only Gammons that won't use their phone instead. Cash not the thing that needed replacing. But hey each to their own

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

only to a degree , i have to say the entire control issue gets on my nerves big time , until not too long ago marijuana was an insidious drug sending people mad and ruining lives , you could be put in jail for repeated possession , now its a lifesaver and you can get it from your doctor , it's all about money and control, protecting the economy and shutting down the black money/cash economy imho. i don't do control i'm afraid , never have. I will continue to use cash whenever and wherever possible and will avoid cashless providers.

If you see it like this fine. But at the end of the day if you’ve bought something from a shop you’ve used your card…the only difference is you’ve used it in the ATM to withdraw the cash first.

And good luck using cash with online purchases.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Good to see the use of cash has gone back up.

Think it’s much better for budgeting and helping small businesses.

Cash use grows for first time in 10 years as people pay closer attention to household budgets

Coins and banknotes accounted for nearly a fifth of transactions in 2022 as people use physical funds to better manage their money.

news.sky.com

Agreed - when, in the past, I've been 'between jobs', I always pulled out all my JSA into cash as well as doing cash in hand jobs. It makes the budgeting much easier as well as stops leaching companies taking it from your bank account.

 

[beorhthelm]

Cash and Phone apps for the last 10-12 years (UK debit card only for online). Sweden, Hong Kong, Mainland China and then Philippines have all been using QR codes and phone apps for years and pre-covid it always felt UK was a bit behind. To me cards are the thing that's doomed and it's only Gammons that won't use their phone instead. Cash not the thing that needed replacing. But hey each to their own

going to phones is stacking about 3 technologies and points of failure on top of banking.

 

[BN9 BHA]

. To me cards are the thing that's doomed and it's only Gammons that won't use their phone instead. Cash not the thing that needed replacing. But hey each to their own

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

only to a degree , i have to say the entire control issue gets on my nerves big time , until not too long ago marijuana was an insidious drug sending people mad and ruining lives , you could be put in jail for repeated possession , now its a lifesaver and you can get it from your doctor , it's all about money and control, protecting the economy and shutting down the black money/cash economy imho. i don't do control i'm afraid , never have. I will continue to use cash whenever and wherever possible and will avoid cashless providers.

I do admire your spirit and attitude though. It's like @cunning fergus and his rebelion in France, he stuck two fingers up to the French by not carrying ID with him for one single second in Marseille. They're probably still reeling from this as I type. I heard he also smuggled a porn mag and and some bangers back.

 

[The Clamp]

For those concerned, I should think cash will always be king to some establishments.

As much as the world is heading into the realms of exclusively digital, there is also a strong movement back towards shopping local, using grocers and butchers etc.

I even traded produce form my allotment for stuff from the local shop when I was in my lost years, living in deepest darkest Surrey.

A local trader will always accept cash. I reckon.

At the moment it’s a lifestyle choice. But certainly, and thankfully, long gone are the days I used to take en envelope of cash to the letting agent each month to pay my rent.

Obviously I still deliver a fivers worth of livestock to Bozza each month as payment for my use of NSC. I missed a payment once. I’m still waiting for him to release my first born.

 

[sydney]

Hastings is the centre of the known universe you know.

 

[dsr-burnley]

Cash and Phone apps for the last 10-12 years (UK debit card only for online). Sweden, Hong Kong, Mainland China and then Philippines have all been using QR codes and phone apps for years and pre-covid it always felt UK was a bit behind. To me cards are the thing that's doomed and it's only [deleted] that won't use their phone instead. Cash not the thing that needed replacing. But hey each to their own

I can see the advantage of using phones. You have your money, your phone, your car key, all on one simple device. Nothing else to carry.

And then again ....

The lady ahead of me in the supermarket queue, and her phone packed up. She couldn't pay for her shopping, she couldn't get into her car, she couldn't pay for a taxi, she couldn't ring her husband to ask him to come and help.

It's a modern thing, to assume that technology can never go wrong. Hence the government's desire to make houses run of electricty and nothing but electricity, on the assumption that the electricity will never fail Hence the phone companies' determination to run the phones through the internet, so when the internet breaks yo can't contact them to report it. And hence the whole Post Office scandal.

There are a lot pf people who need to learn that technology is not infallible. The option of electronic money AND cash is better than the no-option of electronic money only.

 

[Bodian]

I can see the advantage of using phones. You have your money, your phone, your car key, all on one simple device. Nothing else to carry.

And then again ....

The lady ahead of me in the supermarket queue, and her phone packed up. She couldn't pay for her shopping, she couldn't get into her car, she couldn't pay for a taxi, she couldn't ring her husband to ask him to come and help.

It's a modern thing, to assume that technology can never go wrong. Hence the government's desire to make houses run of electricty and nothing but electricity, on the assumption that the electricity will never fail Hence the phone companies' determination to run the phones through the internet, so when the internet breaks yo can't contact them to report it. And hence the whole Post Office scandal.

There are a lot pf people who need to learn that technology is not infallible. The option of electronic money AND cash is better than the no-option of electronic money only.

Went to the barber today. Paid in cash. He was having great trouble with his phone and payment system, as it had got damp - when I arrived it was to the unusual sight of a barber trying to blow dry a phone's interior via the charging slot!

 

[The Clamp]

I can see the advantage of using phones. You have your money, your phone, your car key, all on one simple device. Nothing else to carry.

And then again ....

The lady ahead of me in the supermarket queue, and her phone packed up. She couldn't pay for her shopping, she couldn't get into her car, she couldn't pay for a taxi, she couldn't ring her husband to ask him to come and help.

It's a modern thing, to assume that technology can never go wrong. Hence the government's desire to make houses run of electricty and nothing but electricity, on the assumption that the electricity will never fail Hence the phone companies' determination to run the phones through the internet, so when the internet breaks yo can't contact them to report it. And hence the whole Post Office scandal.

There are a lot pf people who need to learn that technology is not infallible. The option of electronic money AND cash is better than the no-option of electronic money only.

Phones very rarely “pack up”. Especially with no warning.

Same scenario would apply if she’d lost her handbag with her keys, cards, phone etc.

Nobody thinks that tech can’t fail but with a little foresight, disaster can be averted.

Personally, I agree with you. Cash and Card, please.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I can see the advantage of using phones. You have your money, your phone, your car key, all on one simple device. Nothing else to carry.

And then again ....

The lady ahead of me in the supermarket queue, and her phone packed up. She couldn't pay for her shopping, she couldn't get into her car, she couldn't pay for a taxi, she couldn't ring her husband to ask him to come and help.

It's a modern thing, to assume that technology can never go wrong. Hence the government's desire to make houses run of electricty and nothing but electricity, on the assumption that the electricity will never fail Hence the phone companies' determination to run the phones through the internet, so when the internet breaks yo can't contact them to report it. And hence the whole Post Office scandal.

There are a lot pf people who need to learn that technology is not infallible. The option of electronic money AND cash is better than the no-option of electronic money only.

This is nothing more than the digital version of losing/forgetting your wallet or car keys though

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

Direct bank fees and charges can be avoided but you are paying bank charges indirectly in the prices of the goods you buy.

The prices of goods you buy *should be the same regardless of whether you're paying by cash, card or bank transfer.
So are you saying cash buyers are paying bank charges indirectly?

*should = not so long ago some traders added a percentage on for credit card purchase transactions but this is now not permitted - maybe they all put their prices up to cover this and cash payers are being fleeced a bit extra? Is this what you mean?

 

[Denis]

I couldn’t think how to start a thread, but it does come under ‘financial’.
Any advice, please. I ordered a battery for my cordless trimmer, but realised it wouldn’t fit. The company said they had issued a refund to my Mastercard. On closer look at the refund receipt it was showing the wrong last four numbers of my card. I paid by ApplePay (linked to that card). I quickly emailed back with photo of original receipt and their return receipt highlighting that the card last four numbers didn’t match. I couldn’t seem to make the reader understand and she just wrote back saying it would go back to my PayPal account, (which I didn’t use).
My PayPal account isn’t actually with the email that I placed the order.
My question is, will Mastercard and PayPal throw out the refund as the details don’t match, so the mistake is really noticed and the stupid woman makes some attempt to issue my refund. I’m getting so frustrated that no one can admit their mistake.