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Cardiff removed safety fence



eastlondonseagull

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2004
13,385
West Yorkshire
GermanShepherd said:
reading this thread, and still wonder if some of the posters have been to ninian recently, and if they all believe word for word whats printed in the gutter press...

last season: 8 arrests at ninian, 1 for throwing a missile, 7 for being drunk, entering the ground...

enough said....


But that's just cos the police in the ground are running scared :p




;)
 




Man of Harveys

Well-known member
Jul 9, 2003
18,896
Brighton, UK
GermanShepherd said:
reading this thread, and still wonder if some of the posters have been to ninian recently, and if they all believe word for word whats printed in the gutter press...

last season: 8 arrests at ninian, 1 for throwing a missile, 7 for being drunk, entering the ground...

enough said....

greetz from cardiff

That, as reported, the police turn a blind eye to trouble there?

(And I haven't been to Ninian Park since 1978 - I was eight - so I can't really comment on more recent events there.)

I guess we also know that there are also decent Cardiff fans like yourself out there, so schoene Gruesse back atcha.
 


Brighton till i die

You havin' a bubble?
Jan 31, 2004
7,611
On the terraces!!
GermanShepherd said:
reading this thread, and still wonder if some of the posters have been to ninian recently, and if they all believe word for word whats printed in the gutter press...

last season: 8 arrests at ninian, 1 for throwing a missile, 7 for being drunk, entering the ground...

enough said....

greetz from cardiff

fair play your lot have sorted out a lot of the probs - however once outside the ground it is still interesting!!

Infact the fierce atmosphere was something i relished when going up there - granted i wouldnt want a kicking outside but the fact the whole experience is "on edge" makes it (personally) a bit more of a laaaaarf!:D
 
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BHA Jordan said:
Never really been interested to go to Ninian Park, but will do one day, and it wont be something that I'll look forward to as heard enough stories to last me a lifetime

Don't be put off, read the posts from German Shepherd and Bozza. The situation has improved dramatically in recent years. Our recent game there, the atmosphere was totally normal. There is a danger that a lot of the people who post about the Cardiff hoolie problem are living in the past. Just as at Millwall, we must recognise progress has been made and not create myths.
 




Uncle Buck said:
So speaks somebody that has never been to Ninian Park.

OK, your method of argument seems to be that whoever has been to Ninian the most, wins the argument.

The police who have implemented this idea go to every home game. I'm guessing German Shepherd does too.

So by your own reasoning, everyone should listen to them rather than a once-a-year tourist like you, isn't that so?
 


Uncle Buck

Ghost Writer
Jul 7, 2003
28,075
London Irish said:
OK, your method of argument seems to be that whoever has been to Ninian the most, wins the argument.

The police who have implemented this idea go to every home game. I'm guessing German Shepherd does too.

So by your own reasoning, everyone should listen to them rather than a once-a-year tourist like you, isn't that so?

Not in the slightest.

However I doubt you went there when it was an extremely unpleasant visit.

Last season I was impressed at how much the place had improved since our previous visit in the 2001/02 season, but it does not get away from the fact that in the past it had been a horrid place to go and I would not be happy going there without adequate segregation.
 


Uncle Buck said:
Not in the slightest.

However I doubt you went there when it was an extremely unpleasant visit.

Last season I was impressed at how much the place had improved since our previous visit in the 2001/02 season, but it does not get away from the fact that in the past it had been a horrid place to go and I would not be happy going there without adequate segregation.

.......................and the fun and trepidation is outside the ground, to the point that if you are sensible you make plans to visit nice establishments well away from Carfiff fans.
 




Uncle Buck said:
I would not be happy going there without adequate segregation.

Well, you can study the evidence of how well this idea works for virtually an entire season before we go back there? That should put you more at ease?

For me, the bottom line is the police are not going to make their safety job more difficult for the sake of it. There must be a logic to what their doing, they would not put their own officers or the stewards at any more risk.

Like all of us on here, I don't profess to be a crowd safety expert. But my guess would be that if you lock fans up in cages, often you are provoking them to behave like caged monkeys. Normalise the situation, and you are demanding their behaviour improves and giving them less excuse to behave provocatively.

The facts seem to be that the police in co-operation with the vast majority of Cardiff fans have got a handle on the sitiation at Ninian and now they are concentrating on this one left-over from the bad old days.

Let's see how it works in practice before condemning it.
 


Lammy

Registered Abuser
Oct 1, 2003
7,581
Newhaven/Lewes/Atlanta
London Irish said:
Well, you can study the evidence of how well this idea works for virtually an entire season before we go back there? That should put you more at ease?

For me, the bottom line is the police are not going to make their safety job more difficult for the sake of it. There must be a logic to what their doing, they would not put their own officers or the stewards at any more risk.

Like all of us on here, I don't profess to be a crowd safety expert. But my guess would be that if you lock fans up in cages, often you are provoking them to behave like caged monkeys. Normalise the situation, and you are demanding their behaviour improves and giving them less excuse to behave provocatively.

The facts seem to be that the police in co-operation with the vast majority of Cardiff fans have got a handle on the sitiation at Ninian and now they are concentrating on this one left-over from the bad old days.

Let's see how it works in practice before condemning it.

:clap2:
 


Bwian

Kiss my (_!_)
Jul 14, 2003
15,898
GermanShepherd said:
reading this thread, and still wonder if some of the posters have been to ninian recently, and if they all believe word for word whats printed in the gutter press...

last season: 8 arrests at ninian, 1 for throwing a missile, 7 for being drunk, entering the ground...

enough said....

greetz from cardiff

The fence works then.....
 




Uncle Buck

Ghost Writer
Jul 7, 2003
28,075
London Calling said:
.......................and the fun and trepidation is outside the ground, to the point that if you are sensible you make plans to visit nice establishments well away from Carfiff fans.

Ah the little groups of their lads that used to wait up the road for us, or the police telling us that as we had got the train we were on our own after the game. Happy days. However last season it was totally different from 5 years ago and credit to Cardiff for looking to sort it.
 


Brighton till i die

You havin' a bubble?
Jan 31, 2004
7,611
On the terraces!!
London Irish said:
Well, you can study the evidence of how well this idea works for virtually an entire season before we go back there? That should put you more at ease?

For me, the bottom line is the police are not going to make their safety job more difficult for the sake of it. There must be a logic to what their doing, they would not put their own officers or the stewards at any more risk.

Like all of us on here, I don't profess to be a crowd safety expert. But my guess would be that if you lock fans up in cages, often you are provoking them to behave like caged monkeys. Normalise the situation, and you are demanding their behaviour improves and giving them less excuse to behave provocatively.

The facts seem to be that the police in co-operation with the vast majority of Cardiff fans have got a handle on the sitiation at Ninian and now they are concentrating on this one left-over from the bad old days.

Let's see how it works in practice before condemning it.
id rather not risk it and leave each set of fans properly segregated.

adds to the spice!!:cool:
 


Uncle Buck

Ghost Writer
Jul 7, 2003
28,075
London Irish said:
Well, you can study the evidence of how well this idea works for virtually an entire season before we go back there? That should put you more at ease?

For me, the bottom line is the police are not going to make their safety job more difficult for the sake of it. There must be a logic to what their doing, they would not put their own officers or the stewards at any more risk.

Like all of us on here, I don't profess to be a crowd safety expert. But my guess would be that if you lock fans up in cages, often you are provoking them to behave like caged monkeys. Normalise the situation, and you are demanding their behaviour improves and giving them less excuse to behave provocatively.

The facts seem to be that the police in co-operation with the vast majority of Cardiff fans have got a handle on the sitiation at Ninian and now they are concentrating on this one left-over from the bad old days.

Let's see how it works in practice before condemning it.

Steve, as I said, I thought last season that Cardiff City deserved a lot of credit for looking to sort a long standing problem.

However it does not get away from the fact that previous visits, going back to the mid 1990's had been unpleasant, to the point where leaving the ground had an element of running the gauntlet about it.
 






Bwian

Kiss my (_!_)
Jul 14, 2003
15,898
London Irish said:

Like all of us on here, I don't profess to be a crowd safety expert. But my guess would be that if you lock fans up in cages, often you are provoking them to behave like caged monkeys. Normalise the situation, and you are demanding their behaviour improves and giving them less excuse to behave provocatively.

When I started watching football the only reason for fences was to keep the people who came into the lower priced part of the ground out of the more expensive parts. Segregation fences, needed because of trouble, came later, despite people being 'normalised'. The fences were necessary because the fans acted like neanderthals despite being given the opportunity to act like 'normal people' every week. It wasn't a case of treating people like animals turning them into animals.

I hope the experiment works at Cardiff and extends to the car parks around the ground which is where most of the unpleasantness occurs.
 
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Bwian said:
When I started watching football the only reason for fences was to keep the people who came into the lower priced part of the ground out of the more expensive parts. Segregation fences, needed because of trouble, came later, despite people being 'normalised'. The fences were necessary because the fans acted like neanderthals despite being given the opportunity to act like 'normal people' every week. It wasn't a case of treating people like animals turning them into animals.

I hope the experiment works at Cardiff and extends to the car parks around the ground which is where most of the unpleasantness occurs.
.....and anywhere towards the station.

But I hav'ent been in the last couple of years, so i go along with the buck.
 


Uncle Buck said:
Adds to the spice and to your life expectancy.

I do get the impression that neither Lammy or Mr Smith have been to Cardiff when it was a truely unpleasant experience.

No, I'm not a boastful Superfan like you who tells everyone how many games they've been to over the years.

But I've seen enough at Ninian to know it's a safe ground now to visit, and it you want to glorify yourself about how you ran the gauntlet in the bad old days, then it's up to you, but it creates a false impression for the many on here who have never been to Ninian.

You shouldn't be posting scare-mongering stuff that, if people believe, could reduce the amount of fans we will take to Ninian next year. Aren't you always the one whingeing about how few fans we take away?
 
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Uncle Buck

Ghost Writer
Jul 7, 2003
28,075
London Irish said:
No, I'm not a boastful Superfan like you who tells everyone how many games they've been to over the years.

But I've seen enough at Ninian to know it's a safe ground now to visit, and it you want to glory in the myths of the good old days, then it's up to you, but it creates a false impession for the many on here who have never been to Ninian. You shouldn't be posting scare-mongering stuff that, if people believe, could reduce the amount of fans we will take to Ninian next year.

Once again you are not taking on board all of what I said, but then that is your way and don't we know it.

Regarding people being put off, last season we took around 500 there and that is the most I have seen go there, so Cardiff City's measures are encouraging people back, so credit there. However there are people that will not go due to the reputation of the place, and the reputation was gained for a reason.

Now as I said earlier, last season it had improved no end on our visit in 2001 and credit to the club for looking to sort a long standing problem. Now it is no myth what happened, particualy that game in 2001, but the previous year it had been iffy, but then you probably did not support us then, so we will just deal in the facts since Mr Smith became a fan.
 
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sully

Dunscouting
Jul 7, 2003
7,940
Worthing
Last year, the car park was not at all unpleasant.

I think I even left my minikit in the back window and returned to a full set of glass.

I think both Cardiff and Millwall have made great strides and have now both been added to my tick list of grounds, whereas five or so years ago I wouldn't have contemplated either.

Let's hope the fence stays down for all the right reasons and that Cardiff have finally beaten the yobs.
 


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