Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊

Burglar who will burgle no longer



clippedgull

Hotdogs, extra onions
Aug 11, 2003
20,789
Near Ducks, Geese, and Seagulls
Understandably the police have to look into the matter, but if this is a genuine death by burglary case, then hopefully case closed.


============================================

Three people have been arrested after a suspected burglar was stabbed to death at a home in Salford.

Reports said the killed 26-year-old man was part of a gang attempting to get into a property on Ethel Avenue in Pendlebury just before midnight on Wednesday.

The owner of the property is believed to have disturbed the group, who were wearing balaclavas, began their raid.

Locals said they understood intruders tried to break into the back door of the home, then police received a 999 call from a woman at the house.

The dead man - who has not yet been named - was apparently carried away from the house by the other gang members.

Greater Manchester Police said an investigation was in its early stages.

"Police were called to an address on Ethel Avenue following reports of a burglary and a group of men carrying an injured man on to Hospital Road," a statement said.

"On arrival at Hospital Road, police found a 26-year-old man with stab wounds. He was taken to hospital where he was pronounced dead."

"Two men and a woman have been arrested and remain in police custody."


View Larger Map

A cordon has been put up around the terrace house, which backs on to open scrubland.

The death comes just 48 hours after David Cameron vowed to bring in stronger measures to protect those who are forced to defend their property.

"We will put beyond doubt that homeowners and small shopkeepers who use reasonable force to defend themselves or their properties will not be prosecuted," he said

The reform will mean they can use reasonable force if they believe their property is under threat.

Currently, they can only act if they feared for their lives.

It was one of several proposals announced by the Prime Minister as he took a tougher stance on law and order, appeasing the Tory right.

The change is expected to be introduced into the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offences Bill within the next few months.
 




Springal

Well-known member
Feb 12, 2005
24,785
GOSBTS
I agree with hitting a burglar or similar, but stabbing them, you ARE attempting to kill them, and imo, that is wrong. Unless of course you are being threatened yourselves...
 






Boris Yeltsin

MR PRESIDENT to you, mate
Feb 13, 2008
491
Moscow
If I'm in this situation, in the middle of the night and it's dark, I'll grab whatever comes to hand to defend myself and my house.

If the bastard intruder in my house dies, so be it.
 




Mellotron

I've asked for soup
Jul 2, 2008
32,482
Brighton
I agree with hitting a burglar or similar, but stabbing them, you ARE attempting to kill them, and imo, that is wrong. Unless of course you are being threatened yourselves...

How can you possibly judge though? If it's dark etc and someone is breaking into your house, you have to assume they are armed and willing to use force. Just don't burgle is what I say.
 








Scoffers

Well-known member
Jan 13, 2004
6,868
Burgess Hill
Presumably you are supposed to check with them first

"Excuse me Mr Burglar, can I just check, are you planning on killing me or not? It;s just because I plan on cracking your skull with my cricket bat and don't want to go to prison myself"

This is crazy. If someone entered my house in the middle of the night, I would beat the crap out of them to defend my wife and 3 young kids, my paternal instincts would not permit me to do anything else
 


Waynflete

Well-known member
Nov 10, 2009
1,105
Two key things in that report, potentially... Firstly, the statement said the burglar received stab 'wounds' (plural). Secondly, the new policy involves the use of 'reasonable' force.

I have no knowledge of this case, obviously, but in a trial the defence would have to demonstrate that stabbing someone multiple times is 'reasonable'. In my opinion it's a dangerous precedent to say that if someone breaks into your house it's okay to stab them repeatedly.
 


Scoffers

Well-known member
Jan 13, 2004
6,868
Burgess Hill
Two key things in that report, potentially... Firstly, the statement said the burglar received stab 'wounds' (plural). Secondly, the new policy involves the use of 'reasonable' force.

I have no knowledge of this case, obviously, but in a trial the defence would have to demonstrate that stabbing someone multiple times is 'reasonable'. In my opinion it's a dangerous precedent to say that if someone breaks into your house it's okay to stab them repeatedly.


But its not one person, it was 4, so that has to be factored in surely, if you were confronted with 4, would you react differently than 1?
 




clippedgull

Hotdogs, extra onions
Aug 11, 2003
20,789
Near Ducks, Geese, and Seagulls
In my opinion it's a dangerous precedent to say that if someone breaks into your house it's okay to stab them repeatedly.

If you had a clear mind then maybe you would have a point. If taken to court then the accused could plead temporary insanity by way of provocation (ie..panic overtook the situation).
 


Meade's Ball

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
13,653
Hither (sometimes Thither)
hamburglar.jpg
 


Waynflete

Well-known member
Nov 10, 2009
1,105
But its not one person, it was 4, so that has to be factored in surely, if you were confronted with 4, would you react differently than 1?

If you had a clear mind then maybe you would have a point. If taken to court then the accused could plead temporary insanity by way of provocation (ie..panic overtook the situation).

Of course. As I said I have no knowledge of this case, whether the homeowners deliberately went after the guy or felt they had no choice, or whatever. If they genuinely feared for their lives then they'd be able to defend themselves under the existing law anyway. But let's say, for example, the burglars were leaving through a window and the homeowner decided to stab the guy repeatedly in the back in an act of revenge, then I expect most people would think that's unacceptable.

Obviously I'm not suggesting that's what happened in this case, just arguing it's not as simple as saying it's okay to stab people because they've broken into your house.
 




Scampi

One of the Three
Jun 10, 2009
1,531
Denton
Is it ok to reserve judgement on this case until more details are released. I know it's the usual policy on nsc to paint things as black or white, but I can see circumstances where the reaction to the burglary could either be reasonable or not.
 


Falkor

Banned
Jun 3, 2011
5,673
Its your property there breaking and entering into your domain, your private space, there threatening your safety you have every right to defend your self and if that means killing them the so be it, f***ing idiot for trying to break in, scum of the f***ing earth good riddance.
 


glasfryn

cleaning up cat sick
Nov 29, 2005
20,261
somewhere in Eastbourne
you step over that line you have to expect just about anything it is after all an Englishmans right to defend his castle/house /bungalow/tent ect ect or are you supposed to hold open house to any twat thats wants your property and then expect the police to recover it.
this burglar just picked the wrong house ............but how many had he done before he reached this one
 


Waynflete

Well-known member
Nov 10, 2009
1,105
Is it ok to reserve judgement on this case until more details are released. I know it's the usual policy on nsc to paint things as black or white, but I can see circumstances where the reaction to the burglary could either be reasonable or not.

I agree with this 100%
 




User removed 4

New member
May 9, 2008
13,331
Haywards Heath
Two key things in that report, potentially... Firstly, the statement said the burglar received stab 'wounds' (plural). Secondly, the new policy involves the use of 'reasonable' force.

I have no knowledge of this case, obviously, but in a trial the defence would have to demonstrate that stabbing someone multiple times is 'reasonable'. In my opinion it's a dangerous precedent to say that if someone breaks into your house it's okay to stab them repeatedly.
I'm pretty sure that the USA , which has a far higher rate of crime than we do , has a lower rate of domestic burglary, could it be that they are pretty much given carte blanche to shoot home invaders ?
 


Tricky Dicky

New member
Jul 27, 2004
13,558
Sunny Shoreham
I'm pretty sure that the USA , which has a far higher rate of crime than we do , has a lower rate of domestic burglary, could it be that they are pretty much given carte blanche to shoot home invaders ?

If that's true, and it's quite possible, don't forget that there is a much higher likelyhood that the home owner will have a gun. Might put some potential burglars off to begin with.
 


Albion and Premier League latest from Sky Sports


Top
Link Here