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Brighton Station car park £90 Parking fine.
- Thread starter saltdeanseagull1
- Start date
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
Can the private company, while not necessarily bothering to pursue the fine, notify the credit rating agency as an unpaid debt against your name? Would be the only thing I would worry about.
If they obtained a ccj yes, but as it's been mentioned they will not go that far because they will not win.
In theory yes but any sensible person would never condone this sort of behaviour. It's recommended that PPCs are ignored as a majority of people have made an innocent mistake and these scum companies then try to scare them into paying an invoice for an amount far in excess of any loss. Indeed, many car parks they patrol are free so no loss is actually occurred. They can't clamp you for unpaid invoices - that would be illegal.
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Just to clarify - the following would have to happen before they could affect your credit record :
> They would need to identify who was driving
> Give them a reasonable time to pay
> Issue court papers
> Win in court ( which YOU have a better chance of winning the lottery AND bagging a steamy session with yourself, Kelly Brook, all of Gullys Girls and Gus than them winning a defended court case )
> You not to pay what the judge ordered
Manx Shearwater
New member
I would never condone this. Parking Operators do have a right to earn money for the services they are providing. What a lot of people object to is the exorbitant charges they ask you for should you (for whatever reason, accidentally or otherwise) fall foul of their made up regulations. What you owe them is the cost of parking there. (e.g. £2 an hour? You owe them £2, £5 an hour? You owe them £5 etc...).
What you DON'T owe them is £100 reduced to £60 if paid within 14 days (or whatever amount they decide). That is the bit that has no legal standing, not the initial car parking fee.
Also, until such time as they take you to court and win (about as likely as me winning the lottery) then the debt is an 'alleged' debt. Clamping for 'alleged' debts amounts to seizing goods in lieu of an outstanding debt, which - without a court warrant and a court appointed bailiff - is illegal.
Is CMS not fit to grace that particular car park?
An interesting idea - what do they expect people without a mobile on them to do ? It's nothing but entrapment. It used to be P&D which worked perfectly well and of course with the barriers prevent any abuse. Strange how they change it for a system that allows abuse and therefore they get to send out their fictitious invoices with very high amounts demanded.
To issue a ccj they would not necessarily have to do all them things WS, anyone can put in a claim to the courts if you believe you are owed money, it's used as another bluffing tool when issued because you have to respond or judgement will be entered against you by default.
ppo's will not take this option because they know someone will put in a defence and they will then have to prove the money is owed, which of course they can't because they don't have a valid contract. Of course if they did issue one and you did not respond within 14 days it would be registered with cra's if you did not cough up in 30 days. i have issued a few in my time and they work a treat.
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/web/mcol/welcome
Or alternatively go and see the man in the Kiosk and or use the payment machine next to the kiosk - its 2012 mate not hard to pay if you dont want a fine. When has it ever been possible to park anywhere in brighton for free? Its not exactly a new idea sweeping the nation to have to pay to park your car.
or alternatively go and see the man in the kiosk and or use the payment machine next to the kiosk - its 2012 mate not hard to pay if you dont want a fine. When has it ever been possible to park anywhere in brighton for free? Its not exactly a new idea sweeping the nation to have to pay to park your car.
It's not a fine !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am not sure what your arguement is - you said yourself that you were happy to use the pay and display and i assume if you didnt pay that you would expect a ticket and a fine. Everyone seems to accept the premise that you have to pay to park your car in most car parks especially station ones. If you dont you run the risk of getting a fine. Whether you want to pay it or not or you feel it is some way unjust is a completely different arguement. I would say 99.9% of the population understand the parking payment transaction. I dont accept its entrapment when you have a variety of ways to pay all clearly sign posted. I guess we all have choices park and pay no stress, park and dont pay stress. Simples really.
Manx Shearwater
New member
Not that simples.
You don't appear to grasp the difference between council tickets and private 'tickets' (which are actually invoices).
If I park in contravention of a council traffic order in council controlled parking area then this is covered by legislation and I can be fined. So yes, in that instance I would expect a fine.
In a car park run by a private company, if I breached their terms and conditions then legally they are only entitled to the actual losses suffered as a result. They are not a statutory body and the car park does not come under traffic legislation so no, I would not expect a fine. I would expect a demand for the actual amount they lost as a result of my 'contravention'.
The gist of this being, that we are pointing out that this private company has no right to demand £90 when in actual fact it has suffered a financial loss of a few quid. The law reinforces this.
You don't appear to grasp the difference between council tickets and private 'tickets' (which are actually invoices).
If I park in contravention of a council traffic order in council controlled parking area then this is covered by legislation and I can be fined. So yes, in that instance I would expect a fine.
In a car park run by a private company, if I breached their terms and conditions then legally they are only entitled to the actual losses suffered as a result. They are not a statutory body and the car park does not come under traffic legislation so no, I would not expect a fine. I would expect a demand for the actual amount they lost as a result of my 'contravention'.
The gist of this being, that we are pointing out that this private company has no right to demand £90 when in actual fact it has suffered a financial loss of a few quid. The law reinforces this.
Exactly well put, the business model of these companies is built on the extortionate charges that they try to get mugs to pay, they could not make money otherwise.
I dont disagree with you at all. I understand its a private company and like i said you can decided to contest/not pay it. I was just saying its not entrapment when clearly marked how to pay and gives you a number of payment options. You have to be pretty niave to think you you wont get a fine/invoice/penalty or whatever if you dont pay when you are in a car park - whatever the legalities of the fine. Like i said you can argue them at a later date. I personally wouldnt want the hassle and stress of it all. Whatever the rights and wrongs i dont think its entrapment that was my point.
Fair enough - we can agree or disagree on the entrapment bit but please, please, please, stop calling it a fine. Only the police, council or court can fine you. I'm really not sure what stress you think you get ignoring the PPC - I've done it twice and had a total of 5 threatening, badly written letters. Hardly difficult to put in the cat litter tray and go about normal life.
Manx Shearwater
New member
I take your point.
I guess the 'entrapment' issue does boil down to how clear the signs are, and you make a good point about no one should expect free parking in Brighton so there must be some charges involved.
I've seen examples where there is clear entrapment by some of these companies (there was a very well known case on Watchdog last week of a company in Stockport running a Car Park in a shopping centre where the words 'pay and display' were in letters barely a centimetre high on huge notices, where thousands of motorists had received demands for not paying and displaying - they had assumed it was a normal free parking in a retail park), however I'm not familiar with the signs in the car park in question here, so I guess I can't really comment although I suspect everything can be subjective if you are not a regular in there.
I guess the 'entrapment' issue does boil down to how clear the signs are, and you make a good point about no one should expect free parking in Brighton so there must be some charges involved.
I've seen examples where there is clear entrapment by some of these companies (there was a very well known case on Watchdog last week of a company in Stockport running a Car Park in a shopping centre where the words 'pay and display' were in letters barely a centimetre high on huge notices, where thousands of motorists had received demands for not paying and displaying - they had assumed it was a normal free parking in a retail park), however I'm not familiar with the signs in the car park in question here, so I guess I can't really comment although I suspect everything can be subjective if you are not a regular in there.
QUOTE=Westdene Seagull;4874954]Fair enough - we can agree or disagree on the entrapment bit but please, please, please, stop calling it a fine. Only the police, council or court can fine you. I'm really not sure what stress you think you get ignoring the PPC - I've done it twice and had a total of 5 threatening, badly written letters. Hardly difficult to put in the cat litter tray and go about normal life.[/QUOTE]
they are pretty big over the entrance ( pics posted earlier in thread) and inside. Agreed though generally these people are first class
's.
Horton's halftime iceberg
Blooming Marvellous
I have used that car park twice when working away, i.e driven to my home town and got train to and from Falmer for speed and ease.
If people are saying that private car parks have no right to charge you and this is legally correct then happy days for everyone at the car park. However the signs are pretty clear about how it works, you call a phone number and register your number plate and pay per hour, its about £4 for an evening match, CCTV camaras are then monitoring the parking, peoples arrival and exit times.
Why are private parking charges not included as theft, just curious, garages use the same system it you use their services to buy petrol and then drive off without paying. May have to watch your video clips but currentky working so will do so later...
If people are saying that private car parks have no right to charge you and this is legally correct then happy days for everyone at the car park. However the signs are pretty clear about how it works, you call a phone number and register your number plate and pay per hour, its about £4 for an evening match, CCTV camaras are then monitoring the parking, peoples arrival and exit times.
Why are private parking charges not included as theft, just curious, garages use the same system it you use their services to buy petrol and then drive off without paying. May have to watch your video clips but currentky working so will do so later...