[Politics] Brexit

[WATFORD zero]

Most people what an end to this now, so just let Boris get on with it.

So, because you are now bored of this, you want to go into years (probably decades) of trade negotiations with every major economy in the world (including the EU) from a position of holding your ankles with no lubricant within a hundred miles. And this is going to be 'an end to this' ?

Now I know you get upset when people insult you, but you really don't help yourself, do you ?

 

[Mellotron]

Most people what an end to this now, so just let Boris get on with it.

What do you mean “an end”? Brexit isn’t going away no matter what happens. If we Leave then the push to rejoin will begin immediately, and vociferously. This isn’t ending anytime soon, that’s definite.

 

[pb21]

Johnson doesnt want a no deal brexit, that would be a failure of negotiation. he wants to put enough pressure on EU to tweek the WA backstop and the MPs to back whatever is put in front of them. with chief brexit cheerleader Rees-Moog in government, the ERG will back it. just needs enough Labour to go with it to be sure and cover any mavericks/DUP, and EU to play their part.

I think this is what is going on but do you (does anyone) really think that the current deal is going to be sufficiently changed, particularly with regard to the backstop?

It's going to take more than a tweek, and there are enough MPs who would prefer a no deal Brexit anyway.

 

[BLOCK F]

What a thoroughly unpleasant, bad tempered, noxious thread this is.
Oh for Saturday and thoughts turning to football, thus uniting all the ranters against the real enemy...........Man. City!

 

[Stat Brother]

What do you mean “an end”? Brexit isn’t going away no matter what happens. If we Leave then the push to rejoin will begin immediately, and vociferously. This isn’t ending anytime soon, that’s definite.

I can already hear the Brexiteers moaning about the terms of the rejoining deal because it's nowhere near as good as we had.

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

What do you mean “an end”? Brexit isn’t going away no matter what happens. If we Leave then the push to rejoin will begin immediately, and vociferously. This isn’t ending anytime soon, that’s definite.

Even allowing for this, if we leave on a no deal basis then at the top of the PM's in-tray will be the need to re-open negotiations. Eventually something will be negotiated...…………..

 

[Eeyore]

That was to join the common agricultural policy no one asked us if we wanted to join the EU
regards
DS

It wasn't. We were already part of CAP.

The question was:

Do you think that the United Kingdom should stay in the European Community (the Common Market)?

 

[One Love]

Even allowing for this, if we leave on a no deal basis then at the top of the PM's in-tray will be the need to re-open negotiations. Eventually something will be negotiated...…………..

Too late for all the businesses gone to the wall.

 

[beorhthelm]

I think this is what is going on but do you (does anyone) really think that the current deal is going to be sufficiently changed, particularly with regard to the backstop?

It's going to take more than a tweek, and there are enough MPs who would prefer a no deal Brexit anyway.

depends how many really want to go no-deal. now in government, minds are focused on handling the outcome of that. alot easier to tubthump from the backbenches than being actually responsible. the overridding sticking point of the backstop seems to be that the EU decides if it applies or not, so it may be simply changing this would be sufficient.

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

Too late for all the businesses gone to the wall.

Agreed. As I've said in a previous post, we've become so caught up in the process that we might forget how awful the actual outcomes will be.

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

I can already hear the Brexiteers moaning about the terms of the rejoining deal because it's nowhere near as good as we had.

It's Ok - they'll just blame the EU!

 

[The Clamp]

What a thoroughly unpleasant, bad tempered, noxious thread this is.
Oh for Saturday and thoughts turning to football, thus uniting all the ranters against the real enemy...........Man. City!

Who knew that the potential ruin of our nation through the selfish acts of our politicians and the wresting of democracy from the people by a self serving Tory government would cause such strong feelings? Shocking.

 

[WATFORD zero]

depends how many really want to go no-deal. now in government, minds are focused on handling the outcome of that. alot easier to tubthump from the backbenches than being actually responsible. the overridding sticking point of the backstop seems to be that the EU decides if it applies or not, so it may be simply changing this would be sufficient.

But what change could the EU make to the backstop which still protects their principles of the single market. If the EU 'decides that the backstop no longer applies', then they have no borders and no integrity to their single market

A 'deal' generally has benefits for both sides. This is the reason that nobody from the Leave campaign, Government, or on here, can define a 'good deal'. A deal which benefits Britain, while maintaining the integrity of the EU's single market and meeting all Britain's red lines doesn't exist (and never did!). It was a simple lie by the Leave campaign that has been swallowed hook, line and sinker by large numbers of leave voters.

Of course, it would be very simple to prove me wrong, by simply outlining how a 'good deal' would work (I have been asking for a few months but nobody seems able to do that).

It's the exact same issue that was pointed out during the run up to the referendum, was raised as a major issue the day after the referendum and, 3 and a bit years later, not one person has been able to find a solution to.

 

[BBassic]

Liberal elite is a funny term. It's got its own definition and wikipedia page. But if you search for 'Conservative elite' nothing comes up really. The top result is a story about the role of the conservative elite in helping Hitler rise to power. NOTE - I am not saying Conservatives in this country are Nazi's nor am I comparing them to the group of Germans mentioned above, before anyone gets their knickers in a twist.

I just find it interesting that there's seemingly no such thing as a 'Conservative elite', not that I can find on the first few pages of Google anyway.

Does this mean it doesn't exist? Or does it mean, as I suspect, that it's generally a given that the upper echelons of the Conservative parties are in and of themselves 'The Elite' ?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

It wasn't. We were already part of CAP.

The question was:

Do you think that the United Kingdom should stay in the European Community (the Common Market)?

Just ignore him. We know he hasn't got a clue what he's talking about.

 

[beorhthelm]

Liberal elite is a funny term. It's got its own definition and wikipedia page. But if you search for 'Conservative elite' nothing comes up really. The top result is a story about the role of the conservative elite in helping Hitler rise to power. NOTE - I am not saying Conservatives in this country are Nazi's nor am I comparing them to the group of Germans mentioned above, before anyone gets their knickers in a twist.

I just find it interesting that there's seemingly no such thing as a 'Conservative elite', not that I can find on the first few pages of Google anyway.

Does this mean it doesn't exist? Or does it mean, as I suspect, that it's generally a given that the upper echelons of the Conservative parties are in and of themselves 'The Elite' ?

i think the term you looking for is "the Establishment".

 

[Klaas]

It's Ok - they'll just blame the EU!

Exactly this. This is what we will get for the next decade from the liars, chancers and racists who sold people this shit show and the willfully ignorant, the arrogant, and the bigots who will accept no responsibility for their actions. Not forgetting the press either.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

More kicking the can down the road, adjourned until 3rd September. (edit my correction of the date)

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[Westdene Seagull]

First blocking attempt now delayed until a full court hearing. #desperate

 

[Thunder Bolt]

First blocking attempt now delayed until a full court hearing. #desperate

Why the mocking hashtag? I thought you wanted a deal?
How can Parliament agree on a deal when they're not sitting? This prorogation also stops an important bill on domestic violence going through.