[Politics] Brexit

[brightn'ove]

THE referendum thread (others will be merged with this)

My girlfriends sister's boyfriend, born in London and half Indian was racially abused in London today. Her friend from school was racially abused on a train and was forced to move carriage and not allowed to sit down. These incidents are happening up and down the country, I'm disgusted to live in this country and ashamed to be British. This is what vote leave has legitimised, no matter what the 'moderate' leavers say, you voted on the side of the millions of bigots in this country, hang your heads in shame.

 

[lawros left foot]

Pity you jumped in before I'd finished my post (NSC keeps freezing). There are always odd little moments that for no reason stick in your memory - sights, sounds, smell, everything - but the always stick. Some of them even go back to isolated moments during childhood - you don't know at the time that that is a memory that will still be vivid 50 or more years later. It happens. And no, I don't need counselling, though I do fear for the mental health of some of the more foaming-at-the-mouth angry at losing remainers, still desperately clinging to their 'Leavers are racists' mantra (which sadly, was one of the remainers' more successful propaganda arguments - it fooled loads of gullible young people, after all).

And I can name the ladies in question,they are three daily customers of mine, known as the Three Witches by the staff, also my Brother in Law, a man who voted three times for the BNP, and was warned by OB for racially abusing a traffic warden.
No where have I ever stated ALL leavers were racist, but, there were quite a few who were.

 

[lawros left foot]

Or go mad trying to change something you have no hope of doing! Knock yourself out.

How long did it take the leavers to get us out,45 years?
I won't live that long so I've no chance of beating that.

 

[Steve in Japan]

This is what vote leave has legitimised, no matter what the 'moderate' leavers say, you voted on the side of the millions of bigots in this country, hang your heads in shame.

I am sorry for anybody who is abused. But wiith all respect, bollocks to your last comment. That is not what I voted for. Hate crime laws exist for a reason. Use them.

 

[brightn'ove]

I am sorry for anybody who is abused. But wiith all respect, bollocks to your last comment. That is not what I voted for. Hate crime laws exist for a reason. Use them.

If I voted for something that directly resulted in an increase in racism and hate crimes in this country I would be ashamed with myself.

 

[Baldseagull]

I singled out the first 2 as being blatant rubbish, thats not how sovereignty works. I excluded the other because it was not unprovably false Excuse the mangeled English. The Idea that trade comes with payments/sweateners to 1st world countries who hold a net surpluss balance of trade with you is laughable. Maybe i should of left it in?.

I accept that not all leave voters are Naive or stupid, but you are making it hard mate.

 

[pb21]

Have i said i "think otherwise" or have you just added what you want to think. I just commented on your comment, which really showed what you think, that's all.

Sorry, it's a shame that you seem to appear, by your words and lack of sentiment, to think otherwise.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

My girlfriends sister's boyfriend, born in London and half Indian was racially abused in London today. Her friend from school was racially abused on a train and was forced to move carriage and not allowed to sit down. These incidents are happening up and down the country, I'm disgusted to live in this country and ashamed to be British. This is what vote leave has legitimised, no matter what the 'moderate' leavers say, you voted on the side of the millions of bigots in this country, hang your heads in shame.

Constantly repetition wont make it true I'm afraid. My view is that the Remain campaign legitimised distortion of legitimate opinion by shouting 'racist' as often as it could until some of the mud stuck. Now we are seeing the consequences of a devaluing of the term 'racist'. For the umpteenth time Leaving the EU is not a racist act and Remain were playing with fire by making this characterisation. You can call me Racist because you did not get the outcome you wished for but it wont make it true.

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

My girlfriends sister's boyfriend, born in London and half Indian was racially abused in London today. Her friend from school was racially abused on a train and was forced to move carriage and not allowed to sit down. These incidents are happening up and down the country, I'm disgusted to live in this country and ashamed to be British.

I met my Iranian friend who I went to school with in the late 80's.....we are still very good mates today.....he came to the UK in the early 1980s......

He has lived all over Brighton and has normally seen minor examples of this-he plays football and I can tell you this that most of the racist abuse he receives happens when outside of Brighton and you don't have to go very far in any direction for it to happen...

The point is Brighton has a high turnover of foreign and non foreign visitors and always has......areas that have less in terms of freedom of movement of people (ironic) tend to see more problems..

The point I am making is although Brighton is better an example of how it should be.......vast swathes of the country including Sussex clearly show that integration with migration is a real problem and I think being honest which ever way the vote had have gone last Thursday the problems are inevitable..

This does not make it right and no should such actions be condoned in any way...... but were I as a white English male go into some areas of the larger UK inner cities that have ethnic majorities or for that matter even areas say for example with a high number of Eastern European,i doubt very much that I would be treated as I would be if the opposite were the case in Brighton....

It's a tough problem to tackle..

 

[brightn'ove]

Constantly repetition wont make it true I'm afraid. My view is that the Remain campaign legitimised distortion of legitimate opinion by shouting 'racist' as often as it could until some of the mud stuck. Now we are seeing the consequences of a devaluing of the term 'racist'. For the umpteenth time Leaving the EU is not a racist act and Remain were playing with fire by making this characterisation. You can call me Racist because you did not get the outcome you wished for but it wont make it true.

I don't think you, or the other moderate remainders are racist, I do think you should be ashamed for giving racists a platform however.

 

[Steve in Japan]

If I voted for something that directly resulted in an increase in racism and hate crimes in this country I would be ashamed with myself.

So I shouldn't vote to leave the EU because that is racist in itself, or it might lead to an increase in racism?

I can't legislate for all the stupid people in this country. But I could make a very good case explaining that membership of the EU has led to discrimination against non-EU migrants.

 

[Baldseagull]

Constantly repetition wont make it true I'm afraid. My view is that the Remain campaign legitimised distortion of legitimate opinion by shouting 'racist' as often as it could until some of the mud stuck. Now we are seeing the consequences of a devaluing of the term 'racist'. For the umpteenth time Leaving the EU is not a racist act and Remain were playing with fire by making this characterisation. You can call me Racist because you did not get the outcome you wished for but it wont make it true.

I don't know if you are racist or not, but the racists are in your camp. It would be nice to see you just condemn the abuse and attacks, without trying to rationalise it as a product of political correctness.

 

[brightn'ove]

So I shouldn't vote to leave the EU because that is racist in itself, or it might lead to an increase in racism?

I can't legislate for all the stupid people in this country. But I could make a very good case explaining that membership of the EU has led to discrimination against non-EU migrants.

I'm just so depressed as to what this country has become in just a few days.

 

[Dick Swiveller]

I'm just so depressed as to what this country has become in just a few days.

Yep - lying scumbags of politicians, horrible gloating bad winners and whining losers demanding do-overs.

 

[pb21]

Constantly repetition wont make it true I'm afraid. My view is that the Remain campaign legitimised distortion of legitimate opinion by shouting 'racist' as often as it could until some of the mud stuck. Now we are seeing the consequences of a devaluing of the term 'racist'. For the umpteenth time Leaving the EU is not a racist act and Remain were playing with fire by making this characterisation. You can call me Racist because you did not get the outcome you wished for but it wont make it true.

It's the Brexiters who are claiming that remain think everyone who voted Brexit is racist, and are thereby devaluing it.

In reality a small, but not insignificant, percentage of the Brexit vote was borne of racism or similar feelings, it would be disingenuous to suggest otherwise. Since the vote have these feelings are beginning to manifest as overt behavior, likely as those feelings are wrongly being assumed to have been legitimised,

 

[Steve in Japan]

I'm just so depressed as to what this country has become in just a few days.

I must be honest, so am I. Got to stamp out this racist tendency. We have the laws these days, the police must apply them . And we as members of the public must call it out whenever we see it.

 

[Baldseagull]

I met my Iranian friend who I went to school with in the late 80's.....we are still very good mates today.....he came to the UK in the early 1980s......

He has lived all over Brighton and has normally seen minor examples of this-he plays football and I can tell you this that most of the racist abuse he receives happens when outside of Brighton and you don't have to go very far in any direction for it to happen...

The point is Brighton has a high turnover of foreign and non foreign visitors and always has......areas that have less in terms of freedom of movement of people (ironic) tend to see more problems..

The point I am making is although Brighton is better an example of how it should be.......vast swathes of the country including Sussex clearly show that integration with migration is a real problem and I think being honest which ever way the vote had have gone last Thursday the problems are inevitable..

This does not make it right and no should such actions be condoned in any way...... but were I as a white English male go into some areas of the larger UK inner cities that have ethnic majorities or for that matter even areas say for example with a high number of Eastern European,i doubt very much that I would be treated as I would be if the opposite were the case in Brighton....

It's a tough problem to tackle..

Why do you doubt it? Do you think you would be less welcome in a predominantly black inner city area, than a white one? Are you sure you are not racist?

 

[Baldseagull]

As a leave voter no it's not worth it and this is why we(myself anyway) feel we need the cleanest of breaks and go out altogether...

You know you won't get that though, right?

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

I don't know if you are racist or not, but the racists are in your camp. It would be nice to see you just condemn the abuse and attacks, without trying to rationalise it as a product of political correctness.

Of course I completely condemn all abuse/attacks. I am not rationalizing them in any way. I am though fed up with them being used by people to advance their point of view. A climate was created and my theory is about as valid as the one to which I responded ie guesswork. The people responsible for racist abuse are the racists so lets not cheapen the term. It is emphatically not the case that we cannot leave an organisation that perpetuates poverty and inequality for fear of being called racist. We leave the organisation and arrest all who commit abuse. As I mentioned earlier though this campaign to cheapen and change the vote will undoubtably mean we don't actually leave the EU in the end.

 

[Jim in the West]

I'm just so depressed as to what this country has become in just a few days.

Me too. Two months of blatant lying by politicians. None of whom really seems to have grasped the mess they have created. and it is a mess of gargantuan proportions.