Are the disabled trying to run the country??

[goldstone]

What's all this bloody nonsense about trains having to be taken out of service because the typeface on the information screens is 3mm too small to comply with disability regulations. Has the world gone mad?

Apparently the rules are contained in the Disability Discrimination Act 2005.

How many disabled people are there in this country? Are we really willing to let them rule the fu**ing place? This is absolute crap.

And what's the cost to the average taxpayer? Bloody enormous. How much taxpayers money is spent on putting ramps at every intersection in every town?
How much do shops and restaurants have to spend providing disabled access?
Thousands of seats have been removed from trains to make room for disabled lavatories.

I'm very sorry that some people are disabled. Sh1t happens. But I don't see the need for the rest of us to suffer the cost and inconvenience of trying to make everything "disabled freindly" for a small minority of the population.

Rant over.

 

[Curious Orange]

It is quite a peculiar thing that just because something isn't accessible to everybody that it must then not be available to anyone.

Another example is the public toilet in South Street, Dorking, that was closed simply because it could only be accessed by a short flight of steps. I don't suppose it occurred to the Council to dig a ramp in.

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

Hang on, so some people cant do things because theyre disabled?

I have a disability, which although doesnt restrict me from doing much, makes me see the other side of the story. Too f***ing good that England is finally promoting the Discrimination Act - as theyve left it idle for years

 

[goldstone]

It is quite a peculiar thing that just because something isn't accessible to everybody that it must then not be available to anyone.

Another example is the public toilet in South Street, Dorking, that was closed simply because it could only be accessed by a short flight of steps. I don't suppose it occurred to the Council to dig a ramp in.

That is exactly what is so bloody crazy. Why the hell take the trains out of service or close the public toilet just because of the disabled. Fair enough, when you build new trains or new public toilets then by all means require them to be disabled-friendly. That is reasonable.

 

[Starry]

And what's the cost to the average taxpayer? Bloody enormous. How much taxpayers money is spent on putting ramps at every intersection in every town?
How much do shops and restaurants have to spend providing disabled access?
Thousands of seats have been removed from trains to make room for disabled lavatories.

I'm very sorry that some people are disabled. Sh1t happens. But I don't see the need for the rest of us to suffer the cost and inconvenience of trying to make everything "disabled freindly" for a small minority of the population.

Rant over.

Wow. I'm alright Jack, so sod everyone else.

Sad.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

What's all this bloody nonsense about trains having to be taken out of service because the typeface on the information screens is 3mm too small to comply with disability regulations. Has the world gone mad?

Apparently the rules are contained in the Disability Discrimination Act 2005.

Must have been in the small print

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

That is exactly what is so bloody crazy. Why the hell take the trains out of service or close the public toilet just because of the disabled. Fair enough, when you build new trains or new public toilets then by all means require them to be disabled-friendly. That is reasonable.

So ok, if you were working on the trains, could you go up to someone and go "sorry, this is an old train, which means that you can't fit on, and will have to wait another hour to get on one that will do" - imagine if you were that person?

 

[goldstone]

Hang on, so some people cant do things because theyre disabled?

I have a disability, which although doesnt restrict me from doing much, makes me see the other side of the story. Too f***ing good that England is finally promoting the Discrimination Act - as theyve left it idle for years

So do you agree that taking 28 trains out of service because the letters on the information screens are 3mm too small actually helps anyone? And that includes the disabled who will now have to travel in shorter and therefore more crowded trains.

 

[goldstone]

So ok, if you were working on the trains, could you go up to someone and go "sorry, this is an old train, which means that you can't fit on, and will have to wait another hour to get on one that will do" - imagine if you were that person?

What in fact I would have to say is the following:

"I'm sorry, but due to the Disability Discrimination Act this train has only eight coaches instead of twelve (because 28 trains have been taken out of service and therefore all the remaining ones have less coaches) and therefore as a disabled person you will find the journey on an overcrowded train even less pleasant than will our able-bodied passengers".

 

[B.M.F]

So ok, if you were working on the trains, could you go up to someone and go "sorry, this is an old train, which means that you can't fit on, and will have to wait another hour to get on one that will do" - imagine if you were that person?

I agree with your argument but would you rather have 1 disabled person wait an hour for 1 train or have thousands of people including the disabled person having to wait an hour as a train has been taken out of service.

Yes it is frustrating and more could be done but surely there are better ways around it than to take so many trains out of service at the same time.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

What in fact I would have to say is the following:

"I'm sorry, but due to the Disability Discrimination Act this train has only eight coaches instead of twelve (because 28 trains have been taken out of service and therefore all the remaining ones have less coaches) and therefore as a disabled person you will find the journey on an overcrowded train even less pleasant than will our able-bodied passengers".

Commuting has a hell of a lot to answer for in the South-East. Turns normal civilised people into selfish heartless automatons. How many people moan when they're an hour late for their tea because some poor soul has jumped in front of their train? And, OK, I'm not a big fan of the privatised train companies on the whole, but I'd rather they complied - or were made to comply - with the whole of the Disability Discrimination Act, rather than just the bits that don't inconvenience theColonel Blimps of this world.

 

[Billy the Fish]

Commuting has a hell of a lot to answer for in the South-East. Turns normal civilised people into selfish heartless automatons. How many people moan when they're an hour late for their tea because some poor soul has jumped in front of their train? And, OK, I'm not a big fan of the privatised train companies on the whole, but I'd rather they complied - or were made to comply - with the whole of the Disability Discrimination Act, rather than just the bits that don't inconvenience theColonel Blimps of this world.

I take it you don't commute then. What goldstone has written, in this context, is entirely reasonable

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

I take it you don't commute then. What goldstone has written, in this context, is entirely reasonable

Yes I do commute. And what goldstone has written, in this context, is entirely selfish and heartless. IMHO, like.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

I'll declare an interest here.

From 1999 to 2002, I was a Member of the Disabled Persons Transport Advisory Committee (DPTAC), which is the statutory body appointed by the Government to advise ministers on transport issues that are relevant to people with disabilities.

DPTAC is the body that has the responsibility for supervising the implementation of the Regulations relating to trains, buses and taxis that have been introduced to implement the provisions of the Disability Discrimination Act.

These Regulations include a requirement to provide adequate visual destination displays on trains, to a defined specification.

Train operators are allowed to apply for exemption from the Regulations, provided a good case can be made.

The main issue that DPTAC has to deal with is not really about the detail (as has been reported in this case). It is whether or not a train operator has a history of commitment to improving facilities for disabled people, or whether (to be frank) the operator doesn't give a toss.

My guess is that this particular train operator has a poor record in meeting the needs of disabled people and that DPTAC will have reached the point at which they are saying "Enough is enough". Hence the Committee's refusal to grant an exemption in this particular case.

Unsurprisingly, operators like this tend to be rather fond of rushing off to the media to have a good old whinge.

Don't fall for it. In recent years, public transport has become much more accessible for people with all sorts of disabilities. That process hasn't come about by accident. It's because the various parties have been working very hard to achieve improvements. There's nothing wrong with making life difficult for the rogues who haven't done enough.

 

[tedebear]

Its a fine line we walk as commuters!! I can see Goldstones point, although he has made it somewhat bluntly...I used to commute and I really felt for the disabled people on the old trains, having to be sat in the luggage compartment in the freezing cold in winter....now we have newer trains with ample facilities...but in all honestly taking them out of service to increase the font size on the displays is a little OTT in my opinion....I'm assuming that the conductor or the automated voice which announces when you leave each station, when you're on your way to the next station and just as you're about to arrive at the next station, isn't enough to cover the 3mm shortage in typeface?? a little overkill IMHO, but then again people MUST have something to complain about?

 

[Lord Bracknell]

And incidentally ... legible destination displays on trains benefit ALL passengers, not just the people that goldstone likes to think are a minority.

 

[Billy the Fish]

Yes I do commute. And what goldstone has written, in this context, is entirely selfish and heartless. IMHO, like.

Fair enough. So IYHO, should a large number of trains be mothballed, at great expense to the taxpayer, because an LED sign is 3mm too small?

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Fair enough. So IYHO, should a large number of trains be mothballed, at great expense to the taxpayer, because an LED sign is 3mm too small?

Well I'm a taxpayer, I don't mind chipping in with the expense.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Fair enough. So IYHO, should a large number of trains be mothballed, at great expense to the taxpayer, because an LED sign is 3mm too small?

What about the OTHER features of these trains that fail to provide adequate access - and that the train operator hasn't told us about?

 

[Billy the Fish]

Well I'm a taxpayer, I don't mind chipping in with the expense.

Neither do I, but why take the trains out of service why they're doing it. Just turn the bloody signs off.