Another cycling debate

[sten_super]

BBC NEWS | England | Hampshire | Text driver jailed for bike death

Of course she deserves to have the book thrown at her for driving while using her mobile phone. However nowhere have I found (obviously I wasn't at court so don't actually know for sure) any censure of the cyclist for driving straight through a red light.

Does anyone know, are cyclists legally allowed through red lights? I always stop for them; as far as I'm concerned, I'm driving a vehicle on the road and have to abide by the laws of the road. However a vast proportion of cyclists (certainly here in Cambridge) show a complete disregard for anything else on the road and are quite happy to go through lights/across pedestrian crossings/etc expecting everyone else to get out of their way.

Only last night on my way home, I was sitting in the left hand lane at traffic lights waiting for the lights to change, while a cyclist came flying through, cut across into the middle of the two lanes and went straight across a big box junction without a care in the world. I've absolutely no idea what he thought he was doing. If I'd managed to catch up with him I would have given him a large piece of my mind. It really winds me up when cyclists do this.

Oh dear, this has now turned into a rant. Oops. Anyway, opinions anyone?

 

[Everest]

Does anyone know, are cyclists legally allowed through red lights?

In law, cyclists propel vehicles on the highway and so have to adhere to the same rules as motorists. However, the fines and penalties for offences are different. Cyclists DO NOT qualify for three penalty points for failing to comply with a red light. Offending cyclists, when caught, are given a non-endorsable fixed penalty ticket for £30. There are no offences that carry penalty points for cyclists.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

The majority of cyclists do obey the laws, I certainly do and I know the people who I ride do. I tend to find that when you see someone who clearly appears to know what they are doing, are riding quite proficiently and seem to be dressed appropriately, then its never an issue.

The people that cut you up and ignore traffic rules tend to be (in Brighton at least) the krusty, saving-the-world, more-important-than-you-for-not-driving-a-car type, on what is usually a rusted old mountain bike (probably stolen).

 

[Billy the Fish]

Reading that story, it doesn't say that she was actually on the phone when she hit the cyclist, merely that she was on the phone close to the time of the incident. Has she definitely admitted to texting when she hit the bloke?
It's bad luck for her because by the sounds of it the cyclist was just as culpable, but at the end of the day if you're on the phone and have an accident you're going to have the book thrown at you, end of.

 

[Easy 10]

I would actually say that more oten than not, in my experience, cyclists do not bother stopping at red lights. I see it time and time again - if its "clear" then they'll just go for it. As for pedestrian crossings - forget it. If a cyclist has a bit of speed going, they'll just whoosh straight though. I'm actually SURPISED now if I see a cyclist stop at a red light. If they're not sailing through it, they're mounting the kerb to circumnavigate it.

This woman was clearly very stupid for texting whilst driving, you can't defend that. But she was also rather unfortunate that there was a f***ing idiot on two wheels in her vicinity.

 

[sten_super]

The majority of cyclists do obey the laws, I certainly do and I know the people who I ride do. I tend to find that when you see someone who clearly appears to know what they are doing, are riding quite proficiently and seem to be dressed appropriately, then its never an issue.

The people that cut you up and ignore traffic rules tend to be (in Brighton at least) the krusty, saving-the-world, more-important-than-you-for-not-driving-a-car type, on what is usually a rusted old mountain bike (probably stolen).

Unfortunately that's not the case here in Cambridge... practically everyone owns a bike, and it's a definite minority who adhere to the laws. Most people certainly feel that they are more important than anyone else (be they cars, buses, motorbikes, pedestrians, whatever) and they really f*** me off.

 

[Shegull]

I would actually say that more oten than not, in my experience, cyclists do not bother stopping at red lights. I see it time and time again - if its "clear" then they'll just go for it. As for pedestrian crossings - forget it. If a cyclist has a bit of speed going, they'll just whoosh straight though. I'm actually SURPISED now if I see a cyclist stop at a red light. If they're not sailing through it, they're mounting the kerb to circumnavigate it.

This woman was clearly very stupid for texting whilst driving, you can't defend that. But she was also rather unfortunate that there was a f***ing idiot on two wheels in her vicinity.

I was at a pedestrian crossing one morning and the little green man came on for me but a guy on a bike (who seemed to think that he was in the tour de france) went straight through the red light. Unfortunately for him there happened to be a garda on a bike right behind him and after the garda impatiently waved me across the road he put on his light and siren and went after the said guy on pushbike and pulled him over. Don't think he could have charged him but its the first time I have ever seen that happen.

 

[Theatre of Trees]

I certainly stop at all red lights as a cyclist particulalry at junctions as you were liable to endanger yourself if you jumped the light. Always thought better safe than sorry especially as you used to see many a driver operating a mobile whilst whizzing through the junction. However, if the teenage cyclist had followed my advice perhaps he would still be alive - I also believe the woman deserves what she got because she was endangering others whilst in control of a car.

 

[Questions]

I dont think it was proven that she was actually texting at the time of the accident though she claimed it was minutes earlier. The cyclist was in the wrong in my opinion and this woman is being made an example of. If they could prove she was texting at that exact time then thats different but as far as I know they did not.

If thats right then anyone who has texted whilst driving and had a accident how ever later on is guilty and culpable in that particular incident.

 

[clapham_gull]

Unfortunately I see cyclists jumping red lights on a daily basis in London.

I was almost hit last night by one whilst crossing the road ON A CROSSING.

Again simply jumped the lights.

I spoke to someone at London Transport (I think) regarding a dangerous crossing near my home. Unrelated, but it's a death trap trying to cross the road there.

Anyway got onto the subject of cyclists in London and it's a massive massive problem. They seem unaware of how dangerous their actions are, particularly how it causes confusion for pedestrians because they think the lights have changed.

There is absolutely no excuse for it, but I see it daily.

I'm also bored of the "it because of the cars" argument too. I don't drive up here and it's the cyclists that cause me grief.

 

[Billy the Fish]

Unfortunately I see cyclists jumping red lights on a daily basis in London.

I was almost hit last night by one whilst crossing the road ON A CROSSING.

Again simply jumped the lights.

Funny you should say that because it happened to me this week, the cyclist jumped the lights causing me to stop and wait for him, in which time the lights had gone green and I nearly got run over by a bus.

 

[Badger]

That article seems to be very one-sided. The cyclist clearly broke the law, obviously they didn't deserve to die but I don't think the woman should have been given such a harsh sentence. I personally think she should just be done for texting whilst driving and not for killing someone breaking traffic laws.

 

[Badger]

Funny you should say that because it happened to me this week, the cyclist jumped the lights causing me to stop and wait for him, in which time the lights had gone green and I nearly got run over by a bus.

Exactly the same for me. I stand at the bus stop by Clapham Junction every morning and I would say at least 50% of cyclists come charging past all the buses and then straight through the red light. I have almost been hit twice when crossing the road to get to the bus stop.

 

[newhaven seagull 85]

there are good cyclists and bad cyclists just like there are good motorists and bad motorists, it's just a shame that a bad cyclist and a bad motorist where on the same junction at the same time.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Cyclists revert to being about ten years old when they're on a bike. So they go through red lights, go the wrong way down a one-way street, think it'squite OK to cycle along busy pavements. They also talk to cars, if one does something they don't agree with. That can't be healthy. Only time they act like grown-ups, and crap ones at that, is when a pedestrian dares stray onto their precious cycle lane. The one on the seafront being the worst example by far. Lecturing some old dear who in that particularly pompous cyclist way just marks them down as a scumbag. Destroy!

 

[clapham_gull]

Funny you should say that because it happened to me this week, the cyclist jumped the lights causing me to stop and wait for him, in which time the lights had gone green and I nearly got run over by a bus.

I saw an elderly women nearly hit by a bus for the same reason.

I've seen in the press that one of the reasons why successive governments are so bad at for example putting in cycle lanes everywhere is that the receive many complaints regarding the conduct of cyclists.

I'm sure the majority of cyclists obey the law, but there are some right idiots out there.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

Unfortunately that's not the case here in Cambridge... practically everyone owns a bike, and it's a definite minority who adhere to the laws. Most people certainly feel that they are more important than anyone else (be they cars, buses, motorbikes, pedestrians, whatever) and they really f*** me off.

Can't speak for Cambridge but maybe I should rephrase what I meant:

In my experience most CYCLISTS adhere to traffic laws, a lot of PEOPLE ON BIKES don't. I know its pedantic as feck to draw a line between the two, but I genuinely feel that most experiences cyclists/mountain bikers behave themselves, and its idiots who have no idea what they're doing (and probably have never driven either) that cause the problems.

 

[lost in london]

I'm a cyclist in London, and I jump lights, occasionally go onto the pavement, go the wrong way up one way streets very occassionally and all sorts of things that are illegal, and I know 100% that it is wrong.

The way I see it though is that every time I do something illegal it is a calculated risk, I would never jump a red light if there are any pedestrians around at all, but I would for example jump the red lights on the Mall if there were no cars joining from the left or any pedestrians; in the same way I would never go on the pavement or the wrong way up a one way street if there are any people around or any way that I could cause myself or anyone else harm.

Unfortunately there are idiots around, in much the same way as there are idiots who drive cars. Pretty much everyone speeds in cars, but it's when and where you do it that defines you: 50 in a 20 area outside a school at 3pm vs 90 on a dry empty motorway, most have done the latter, only the moronic the former.

Do all pedestrians obey the little green / red man? Of course not, it's a calculated risk that we all take when sprinting across the road just in front of someone.

It is the idiots who give pedestrians, cyclists, and drivers bad names, and I agree 100% with the post above that it is the people on bikes who don't wear any hi-vis clothing, don't wear helmets or don't have lights that tend to be the poorest cyclists and the biggest danger.

Please don't take this to be a justification of breaking the law, I know what I do is 'wrong', but just thought I would put across a cyclist's / my point of view.

 

[Spiros]

That article seems to be very one-sided. The cyclist clearly broke the law, obviously they didn't deserve to die but I don't think the woman should have been given such a harsh sentence. I personally think she should just be done for texting whilst driving and not for killing someone breaking traffic laws.

Agreed. This seems less about justice and more about 'setting an example'. OK she should be punished if she has definitely been texting while driving, but the guy jumped the red light at a busy junction - surely that contributed more to the accident than her using the phone, as she at least went through a green light.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

Agreed. This seems less about justice and more about 'setting an example'. OK she should be punished if she has definitely been texting while driving, but the guy jumped the red light at a busy junction - surely that contributed more to the accident than her using the phone, as she at least went through a green light.

There seems a lot that it doesn't mention though: did she stop, how fast was she going etc etc. Still though, 4 years, thats more than Lee Hughes isn't it?!