[Football] Another big problem with VAR

[Sheebo]

If anyone’s watching The Scouse Derby it will help but this also happened to us a few times - notably Murray v Bmuff I think:

Ball played in to Liverpool player (he’s offside) - Lino keeps flag down as are told not to flag until after if they think it may be off / unless it’s really obvious. Pickford saves well. Corner given.

Had the ball gone in, Everton would have a free kick given by VAR. As it happens, because their keeper did well, they had to defend a corner and could have conceded.

It just doesn’t sit well with me and is mostly down to VAR and linos told not to flag unless completely sure.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Yes, it is ridiculous that a team could be penalised for a piece of great skill. Bin it.

 

[Bakero]

Lineker at half-time referred to us a Premier League strugglers. Is that fair? We're a win away from top half and just a point of 11th placed Everton, who we play next weekend.

 

[BensGrandad]

My son and I were just saying VAR should have intervened and given a free kick to Everton for offside. Had Liverpool scored a good goal from the corner would they have wiped it out because of the offside and the corner shouldnt have been given?

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Lineker at half-time referred to us a Premier League strugglers. Is that fair? We're a win away from top half and just a point of 11th placed Everton, who we play next weekend.

We'll only know if we are PL strugglers or not after the quadruple header vs Villa, Bournemouth, West Ham and Watford.

 

[Bakero]

We'll only know if we are PL strugglers or not after the quadruple header vs Villa, Bournemouth, West Ham and Watford.

True. An important couple of month coming up.

 

[Normal Rob]

True. An important couple of month coming up.

Plus you're missing an important point. That being that Mr Lineker is a total bell-end.

 

[Perkino]

I'd like a trial of VAR only at the referees request otherwise get on with the game

 

[BensGrandad]

Interesting point OP.

I am a supporter of VAR for fouls - red cards, such as penalties and diving events.

I personally think VAR should not review offsides AT ALL. The armpit thing is ridiculous - and it has other problems like you mention.

If the offside is not obvious to a lino, then it shouldn't be given. The lino should flag for everything he is 100% confident is offside.

Giving clear and obvious offsides is not the problem it is the marginal fingernail ones that are causing problems and the IFAB has said VAR is not being applied correctly by English refs in the Premier.

 

[Sheebo]

Interesting point OP.

I am a supporter of VAR for fouls - red cards, such as penalties and diving events.

I personally think VAR should not review offsides AT ALL. The armpit thing is ridiculous - and it has other problems like you mention.

If the offside is not obvious to a lino, then it shouldn't be given. The lino should flag for everything he is 100% confident is offside.

I wouldn’t mind that - anything that radically changes how it is. If the Lino doesn’t flag cos he gets it wrong then fair enough to a degree - human error. If he didn’t flag in this incident cos he thought ‘I’m 70% sure that was off but I’ve been told not to flag unless certain’ it’s a joke. He then didn’t flag after the shot.
[MENTION=451]BensGrandad[/MENTION] - I get the point but we can’t have VAR interfering like that for goal kicks and corners - it’s slow and opens a can of worms. The whole thing needs to be changed drastically.

 

[pb21]

How was the lino not certain that the Sheffield Utd player was offside when they had a goal disallowed against us!

 

[studio150]

If anyone’s watching The Scouse Derby it will help but this also happened to us a few times - notably Murray v Bmuff I think:

Ball played in to Liverpool player (he’s offside) - Lino keeps flag down as are told not to flag until after if they think it may be off / unless it’s really obvious. Pickford saves well. Corner given.

Had the ball gone in, Everton would have a free kick given by VAR. As it happens, because their keeper did well, they had to defend a corner and could have conceded.

It just doesn’t sit well with me and is mostly down to VAR and linos told not to flag unless completely sure.

Certainly happened with Murray late on against Bournemouth, in fact he was so obviously offside the linesman should have raised his flag.
It also works in reverse, linesman flags for offside and attacking team stop and free kick given, replays show player was onside, but decision can't be reversed unless the attacking team continue playing and score.

Just one of the many issues with VAR.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

My son and I were just saying VAR should have intervened and given a free kick to Everton for offside. Had Liverpool scored a good goal from the corner would they have wiped it out because of the offside and the corner shouldnt have been given?

Did you miss the entire point of the OP?

 

[BensGrandad]

Did you miss the entire point of the OP?

I got the point about the lino not flagging but was extending the argument and showing that VAR as applied now is not fit for purpose.

 

[drew]

Think you'll find that PL linesmen have not been given an instruction not to flag until the passage of play is concluded in case a goal is scored when VAR will review it anyway. Unlike in the World Cup or on the continent, they flag if they see an offside. It's stupid that they don't follow the other countries, especially as the other euro top leagues have had VAR for a year or two longer. A bit like the refs refusal to use the pitch side monitor!!!!


That said, VAR should be used for offside but they should not be able to use these stupid lines. Look at a slow motion replay and if it looks offside then it it is. If you can't tell, ie his armpit is off, then you allow a goal to stand. Would speed up the process.

 

[Blue3]

Hate VAR no that's incorrect what what I hate is the way the FA apply VAR it should only be a tool for the referee on the pitch to refer to if he or she deems it nessasary and any player who lays a hand on the referee should be sent off

 

[Acker79]

Think you'll find that PL linesmen have not been given an instruction not to flag until the passage of play is concluded in case a goal is scored when VAR will review it anyway. Unlike in the World Cup or on the continent, they flag if they see an offside. It's stupid that they don't follow the other countries, especially as the other euro top leagues have had VAR for a year or two longer. A bit like the refs refusal to use the pitch side monitor!!!!

It's a little more complex than that:

https://www.premierleague.com/news/1297403

Where there is a clear and obvious goalscoring opportunity and the assistant referee is not certain whether the attacker actively involved is in an offside position, the assistant should delay indicating the offence until the phase of play has concluded.

Where there is a clear and obvious goalscoring opportunity and the assistant referee is certain the attacker actively involved is in an offside position, then the assistant should indicate the offence immediately.

In both of these situations the referee should wait to blow the whistle until the immediate phase of play has ended.

Factual offside decisions will be based on the evidence provided by fully calibrated offside lines.​

If they are sure it's offside, lino should flag but ref ignore it until the play is over (when there is an imminent goal scoring opportunity). If they are not sure, they shouldn't flag until after the play has concluded when there is an imminent goal scoring opportunity (though, I'd argue if he's not sure he shouldn't flag at all).

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I got the point about the lino not flagging but was extending the argument and showing that VAR as applied now is not fit for purpose.

Well we are in agreement there!