Alonso/Hamilton

[Gritt23]

One of the McClaren team would have to back up any suggestion of gamesmanship

Why would it have to be that way round?

Surely the evidence to the eye is that Alonso sat there letting the clock tick down, and Alonso would need to prove their was a genuine reason why he was sat there other than to screw up his main competitor.

I think the fact that the stewards have stepped in without a team submitting a compaint to the stewards suggests that the stewards need reasurance as to why Alonso acted in the way that he did. They have taken radio transmissions off the team, and clearly want to hear something being said over the radio, preferably mechanical reasons, as to why he can't leave the pits just yet.

Instead they will hear Lewis being told to slow on his in lap, so that the pit stop are timed perfectedly, then engineers shouting at Fernando "why aren't you going?".

I think he's in BIG trouble.

 

[Gully]

Easy way to resolve it is for Lewis to burn past Fernando, when the green lights come on tomorrow, and beat him into the first corner. Hungary is renown for being the track where it is difficult to overtake, the leader at the first corner can dominate the race and should win barring an unforseen catastrophe.

 

[Gritt23]

This simply CANNOT be what Ron Dennis really thinks, as it is completely in contrast to his rather obvious body-language at the end of the session. If that was the inevitable consequence of something that had happened 15 minutes earlier (the start of Q3) then he'd have had that answer for the TV crews immediately the race finished. He also would have been throwing his headphones at the screens in the first lap of qualifying, NOT the last lap. And if Alonso was supposed to be in front of Lewis all along, then the plan would always have been for Alonso to be out of the pits in time for Lewis to be making his pit-stop behind him.

I think this is more to do with Dennis cacking himself that rather than having a front row, if the stewards are not satisfied that this was NOT gamesmanship then he's got one of his drivers heading miles back down the grid. Much better for him to be able to settle this matter in-house, telling Alonso to allow Lewis through on the first bend and for McLaren to bring home a 1-2.

What do you all think?


From ITV.com
Dennis says Hamilton triggered delay
Saturday, 04, August, 2007, 19:56


McLaren boss Ron Dennis says the controversial pit lane incident involving his two drivers during qualifying for the Hungarian Grand Prix was triggered by Lewis Hamilton failing to heed instructions earlier in the session.

Fernando Alonso beat Hamilton to pole position after the British rookie was forced to queue behind him in the pits and then ran out of time to post his final flying lap.

Alonso held station in the pits for around 10 seconds after his mechanic had removed the ‘lollipop’ – the traditional signal for a driver to leave his stall – leaving Hamilton to sit helplessly while the seconds ticking away.

That prompted widespread suggestions that Alonso had deliberately held up his team-mate in order to deny him pole.

But Dennis insists Alonso was simply following a countdown from his engineer and did nothing wrong.

“Fernando was being counted down by his engineer,” Dennis told reporters at the Hungaroring.

“He’s under the control of his engineer. He determined when he goes. That’s the sequence.

“And if you think that was a deliberate thing, then you can think what you want. I have given you exactly what happened.”

Dennis said it was Hamilton’s failure to stick to the agreed procedure during the fuel-burning phase of Q3 that was the catalyst for the delay.

“We have various procedures within the team and prior to practice we determine how it is going to be run, what our strategy is, and how that’s going to be enacted on the circuit,” he said.

“They were out of sequence because Lewis should have slowed and let Fernando past,” he said.

“And he didn’t. He charged off. That’s how we got out of sequence.”

Dennis explained that the plan was for Alonso to complete an extra fuel-burning lap and that Hamilton had been told to let him past to facilitate this.

“In this instance, it was Fernando’s time to get the advantage of the longer fuel burn,” he said.

“The arrangement was that we reverse positions in the first lap.

“That didn’t occur as arranged. That was somewhat disappointing and caused some tensions on the pit wall.

“We were, from that moment on, out of sequence because the cars were in the wrong place on the circuit and that unfolded into the pit stops.

“It complicated the situation and the end result was Lewis not getting his final timed lap.”

Dennis was at pains to stress that McLaren continues to treat both its drivers equally, and that the tensions that arise on such occasions are inevitable when dealing with such competitive individuals.

“Let me make it a very honest answer: it is extremely difficult to deal with two such competitive drivers,” he said.

“There are definite pressures within the team. We make no secret of it.

“They are both very competitive, and they both want to win, and we are trying our very hardest to balance those pressures.

“Today we were part of a process where it didn’t work, and the end result is more pressure on the team.

“But what you hear is the exact truth of what happened, and we will manage it inside the team through the balance of the season.

“Obviously Lewis feels more uncomfortable with the situation than Fernando.

“That’s life, that’s the way it is, and if he feels too hot to talk about it then that’s the way it is.

“But what I’ve done is give you an exact understanding of what took place today.”

 

[Icy Gull]

What do you all think?


.”

I think you answered your own question earlier in this thread

"McLaren have always seemed to be a team focussed on the constructors title as much - if not more - than having the World Champion"

Keeping two drivers on the front row was more important to McClaren than getting Alonso into line

Neither Alonso or Dennis have come out of this very well imo.

 

[clippedgull]

What do you all think?

That might be the official line, but I would wager that is NOT what happened.

Hamilton looked angry in the press conference as did Dennis soon after qualifying finished.

But, like footballers (el Abd anyone?) when the shit hits the fan the manager and team close ranks.

I just hope Lewis kicks the Spaniards ass on the track tomorrow

 

[Gritt23]

I wonder if the deal was Dennis agreeing to keep Alonso out of the shit with the FIA, in exchange for Alonso letting Lewis into the first corner first tomorrow.

It had to be in McLarens best interests to leave both on the front row, and to deal with this in house.

 

[Spearritt of the Albion]

Alonso has been moved 5 places down the grid as punishment -

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/6929333.stm

 

[Gully]

OK, based on my earlier comment about the driver who gets to the first corner ahead of the field being able to control the race, if that is Hamilton (fingers crossed) then he should be able to go on and win judging by his performances so far...if he doesn't and it isn't because of mechanical failure or one of the monkeys from the back of the grid (his words, not mine) driving into him, then I would smell a very large rat at Mclaren.

 

[Rangdo]

Alonso has been moved 5 places down the grid as punishment -

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/6929333.stm

On the news they just said that Mclaren won't be able to score any constructors points as part of the punishment.

Dennis wil not be happy about that one. Alonso is in for the cold shoulder treatment methinks

 

[dougdeep]

Alonso has been moved 5 places down the grid as punishment -

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/6929333.stm

That's ruined the race then.

 

[Icy Gull]

On the news they just said that Mclaren won't be able to score any constructors points as part of the punishment.

Dennis wil not be happy about that one. Alonso is in for the cold shoulder treatment methinks

So the team have been stripped of any points because the colluded to deny any wrong doing to keep the front row all McClaren.

Well done the authorities and shame on Alonso and Ron Dennis

Is Damon Hill going to be commentating on the race? I found it interesting to hear his comments during qualifying, ITV should keep him on.

 

[Jim D]

Seems a strange punishment as nobody was affected but his own team mate. Maybe they were just looking for a way to get at McLaren after letting them off last week.

 

[Icy Gull]

Seems a strange punishment as nobody was affected but his own team mate. Maybe they were just looking for a way to get at McLaren after letting them off last week.

More to do with MClaren trying to cheat by covering up Alonso's wrong doing and hoping to get away without a punishment I would think.

Must say I'm really suprised but pleased they saw fit to punish the whole team except Hamilton

 

[Gritt23]

On the news they just said that Mclaren won't be able to score any constructors points as part of the punishment.

Dennis wil not be happy about that one. Alonso is in for the cold shoulder treatment methinks

I think that is putting it rather mildly. A race that should have seen McLaren take a dominant position in the constructors race, with the front row, AND Massa way down the field, has turned into Ferrari closing up ahead of some tracks that will suit the Ferrari.

Dennis will be absolutely LIVID! Nice to see that the FIA have rubbished the cock and bull story that Dennis gave of events last night.

 

[cjd]

If the FIA were running the Premiership, West Ham would be looking forward to Championship football this season.

 

[Woodchip]

Give it a couple of races and Alonso might find a P45 in his wage packet if he carries on like this. He's paid 5 times Hamilton's salary and is drivinfg like a sulky teenager.

McLaren always race for the constructor's title and Alonso has f***ed that up for them this race. God help him in the post race debrief.

 

[Woodchip]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=EYa_766DXzo

 

[Spearritt of the Albion]

Seems a strange punishment as nobody was affected but his own team mate. Maybe they were just looking for a way to get at McLaren after letting them off last week.

That's not the point. They both see themselves as rivals and the FIA are there to make sure that everyone is given a fair chance (well usually!!). If Alonso had blocked anyone else in the pit lane then he would have been in serious trouble so the FIA had to be seen to protect Hamilton.

Not sure if the 5 places punishment was arbitrary or if it reflected Alonso's best time in Q3 before he went out for that last lap.

Should be a good start, though, as I bet that Alonso will do his utmost to get close to Hamilton on the first bend.

 

[Gritt23]

Give it a couple of races and Alonso might find a P45 in his wage packet if he carries on like this. He's paid 5 times Hamilton's salary and is drivinfg like a sulky teenager.

McLaren always race for the constructor's title and Alonso has f***ed that up for them this race. God help him in the post race debrief.

He can certainly kiss goodbye to a drive for them next season, and he better hope Ron Dennis goes after Kubica, as that is the only way a decent drive will be available anywhere else.

 

[Gritt23]

If the FIA were running the Premiership, West Ham would be looking forward to Championship football this season.

My thought EXACTLY!

The amount of money involved in F1 is immense, but that didn't stop them punishing a team and an individual when they contravened the regulations, and then compounded the issue by lying about it afterwards.