All schools being privatised under Tories

[darkwolf666]

no it isnt. privatisation is the trasnfer ownership from the public to private sector. this isnt what is being suggested here, even the Guardian doesnt make this assertion.

and who came up with acedemy schools anyway?

Clearly not you! Oh wait, maybe that is the level of ejukation tort at acedmees

 

[beorhthelm]

Glad we got that sorted then.

Fair point. So why are you saying this is privatisation when the academies remain public sector?

Clearly not you! Oh wait, maybe that is the level of ejukation tort at acedmees

Product of a comprehensive I'm afraid.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I couldn't give a monkeys if their state, private , free or academy schools as long as standards improve and we get value for tax payers money.

 

[yxee]

I can't quite see where in that entirely speculative article it says that schools will be privatised?

Or are shock headlines an acceptable substance for substance?

 

[LlcoolJ]

Fair point. So why are you saying this is privatisation when the academies remain public sector?

So no private companies make money from academies then? Call it what you want and split hairs as much as you like. This is a truly awful idea and to call it the privatisation of our education system isn't far off. Depressing stuff.

 

[carteater]

For ****s Sake .

 

[Mowgli37]

I never thought I'd live to see the day we privatised our education system. What a f*cking mess.

 

[LlcoolJ]

I couldn't give a monkeys if their state, private , free or academy schools as long as standards improve and we get value for tax payers money.

*they're*

Value for money for the taxpayer doesn't usually involve handing millions of £s worth of assets over to private companies so they can use them to turn a profit out of taxpayers cash (which is supposed to be spent on teachers and you know, stuff for teaching kids). How exactly is this supposed to increase standards or be "value for money"? It's bullshit and it doesn't work.

 

[beorhthelm]

So no private companies make money from academies then? Call it what you want and split hairs as much as you like. This is a truly awful idea and to call it the privatisation of our education system isn't far off. Depressing stuff.

ah ok, let just label things we dont like or dont understand with emotive, politically charged terms, so that we can get all angry about them on principle. depressing indeed.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I can't quite see where in that entirely speculative article it says that schools will be privatised?

Or are shock headlines an acceptable substance for substance?

It doesn't but any loosening of state control is considered to be the end of the world by some people hence the over used 'privatisation' term.

 

[n1 gull]

I think getting council the hell away from our schools is on the whole a good idea. More control to the head teachers etc seems to make sense to me

 

[LlcoolJ]

ah ok, let just label things we dont like or dont understand with emotive, politically charged terms, so that we can get all angry about them on principle. depressing indeed.

I understand academies very well thanks. I've seen how they work and I don't like what I've seen. A generalisation based on a small sample size yes, but I've also spoken to plenty of people involved in education and all of them are either skeptical or against the academy model.

It's not getting "angry on principle" when you know what you're angry about and are opposed to it because you believe it to be completely wrong.

But I'm sure you won't let this affect your massive sense of superiority, so it doesn't matter.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

*they're*

Value for money for the taxpayer doesn't usually involve handing millions of £s worth of assets over to private companies so they can use them to turn a profit out of taxpayers cash (which is supposed to be spent on teachers and you know, stuff for teaching kids). How exactly is this supposed to increase standards or be "value for money"? It's bullshit and it doesn't work.

If you have any independent evidence that academies resemble that rather dogma laden and stereotypical description I will take on board your point. As I said I am not particularly pro state or pro academy, I'm pro what works best for standards and delivers a better education for children plus value for money.

 

[Igzilla]

As a Parent Governor of a local primary school, recently rated as Good by Ofsted, we are now faced with either converting now with other like minded schools into a multi school trust, or wait for the Tories to force us unwillingly into a ******* marriage with any crappy old school who will suck our resources and give nothing in return. In addition, to those who don't voluntarily go, they will be open to takeover by an established academy trust, some of which promote Creationism. Thanks, Tories. We are at least trying to be proactive and doing our best to dodge this bullet.

 

[mothy]

Taking it away from public to private = privatisation.

No. The government are still funding the schools. It's just the dfe will pay the money to shools direct instead of via local authority as at present (apart from existing academies).

We (the public) are still paying for these schools via our taxes & so it is not privatisation (admittedly some academy chains are private sector ownership & therefore make profits for the owners, which doesn't make much sense)

 

[mr sheen]

Given the furore this will cause, and it's been on the cards for ages, Osborne must have something really nasty to release behind it

 

[yxee]

So no private companies make money from academies then? Call it what you want and split hairs as much as you like. This is a truly awful idea and to call it the privatisation of our education system isn't far off. Depressing stuff.

What do you mean precisely by "making money"? Trading?

And how is it anything like privatisation?

 

[beorhthelm]

Value for money for the taxpayer doesn't usually involve handing millions of £s worth of assets over to private companies so they can use them to turn a profit out of taxpayers cash (which is supposed to be spent on teachers and you know, stuff for teaching kids).

i was under the private/public schools impression are typically non-profit making. the charity commission seems to think so too.

I understand academies very well thanks. I've seen how they work and I don't like what I've seen. A generalisation based on a small sample size yes, but I've also spoken to plenty of people involved in education and all of them are either skeptical or against the academy model.

so prehaps you can tell me if those academies are privately owned and funded or remain in public ownership. because its not splitting hairs to call it something that it isnt just to prevoke a reaction as this thread has deliberatly done.

i cant say im particularly pro-academy and not in favour of privatisation of schools either - there is no real prospect of competition. but there might be a debate worth having about whether or not there are benefits, because the current system shirley cant be considered great, and lets down large numbers of the population, either in the name of social enginering or chasing arbitary targets.

 

[Igzilla]

i was under the private/public schools impression are typically non-profit making. the charity commission seems to think so too.



so prehaps you can tell me if those academies are privately owned and funded or remain in public ownership. because its not splitting hairs to call it something that it isnt just to prevoke a reaction as this thread has deliberatly done.

What it does is remove the teachers out of a national pay scale and into a "privatised" pay regime, so they will be employed by the Academy trusts, not the LEA or the DfE. As a side effect, and I'm sure the Tories haven't thought of this, it effectively neutralises the teachers unions, as a national strike would become impossible, and effectively illegal.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_(English_school)

Technically it isn't privatisation, but it's close. Any nitwit can run an academy, provided they can fund it, to teach their own ideology. The argument that academies are better doesn't wash as no direct comparisons are available. Some are ok, some of them are rubbish. This policy is entirely about politics, not edukashun.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-35814215
[h=2]"Practical problems[/h]There are a few implementation issues here. The biggest of these is very simple -we do not have enough good academy chains as it is. There is plenty of demand for school support services at the moment and some existing school chains are extremely weak; Sir Michael Wilshaw, the chief inspector, has recently started to worry more about them.
Mary Bousted, general secretary of the Association of Teachers and Lecturers, said: "It is hard to see how the government's plans will work when there aren't enough high quality multi-academy trusts to cope with thousands more schools and some trusts are performing as poorly as the worst local authorities according to Sir Michael Wilshaw."
This proposal would also create a lot of work for the Department for Education, which has struggled with its existing workload. Since 2010, its role has gone from being a strategic body to deciding on rules for individual schools. The skills of its employees have not kept up.
Indeed, even the two most important things a Whitehall department must do, keeping to its budget and being accountable for spending, have proved beyond it. The free school programme showed that even the relatively simple task of opening new schools was extremely trying for them.
The Local Government Association, which represents the boroughs, has expressed concern about school accountability.
Roy Perry, chairman of the LGA's Children and Young People Board, said: "It's vital that we concentrate on the quality of education and a school's ability to deliver the best results for children, rather than on the legal status of a school...
"The LGA opposes both forced academisation, and giving significant powers relating to education to unelected civil servants with parents and residents unable to hold them to account at the ballot box."
Furthermore, this proposal would force the DfE to go ahead with plans to fix a number of awkward funding problems - for example, at what level it ought to fund small schools or schools with expensive private finance deals, for example. At the moment, local authorities absorb those problems. "Academisation" would remove that buffer."