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[Politics] Brexit

If there was a second Brexit referendum how would you vote?

  • Total voters
    1,099


B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
WATFORD zero said:
I'll make a deal with you, you don't tell me your fantasies and I won't tell you mine :wink:



So, is TMs deal miles away, near or over that tipping point ?
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Well it doesn't seem to be on the table though it seems that Barnier has already derided it, I suspect it will be like the 'who wants be a millionaire' where she is forced to swipe it back and say, 'you dont wanna have that' (it only works in a Chris Tarrant voice), and she puts an even tougher set of proposals on the table, which seems to point towards a no deal, but who knows.

I think trade will sort itself out but for me I would expect a clear exit from the auspices of the EU, some vague entanglement in EU regulation to help continued seamless trade in some sectors I doubt would bother me.
 




B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
daveinprague said:
We dont know. my bet is, I suspect, I think

ok, so its up there with possibly, maybe, what could happen, I believe etc etc.
What happens to our trade on day 1 outside the EU if we have no trade deal?
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You're being daft, I am being honest, I cannot know and you certainly can't.

The next day, as I understand it we would be on WTO terms wouldn't we ?

Are you saying this will make our economy crash ?

If so I will counter that by saying I don't think it will .......
 




ManOfSussex

ManOfSussex

We wunt be druv
Apr 11, 2016
15,167
Rape of Hastings, Sussex
Two Professors said:
Agree.The description of the working person sounds exactly like a certain supermarket employee who does nothing but whine,a remoaner.
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Who's the certain supermarket employee among us out of interest you're referring to? I wasn't aware there was one.
 


Baldseagull

Baldseagull

Well-known member
Jan 26, 2012
11,839
Crawley
BigGully said:
You're being daft, I am being honest, I cannot know and you certainly can't.

The next day, as I understand it we would be on WTO terms wouldn't we ?

Are you saying this will make our economy crash ?

If so I will counter that by saying I don't think it will .......
Click to expand...

Oh man, really?
 




ManOfSussex

ManOfSussex

We wunt be druv
Apr 11, 2016
15,167
Rape of Hastings, Sussex
Garry Nelson's teacher said:
"I think trade will sort itself out...……….."


Well that's a problem overcome without too much bother, then.
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It's good to know isn't it. Just need to let The FTA, The RHA, Kent County Council, Kent Police, HMRC, UKBF etc, etc know that they're all worrying over nothing.
 


WATFORD zero

WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,747
BigGully said:
Well it doesn't seem to be on the table though it seems that Barnier has already derided it, I suspect it will be like the 'who wants be a millionaire' where she is forced to swipe it back and say, 'you dont wanna have that' (it only works in a Chris Tarrant voice), and she put an even tougher set of proposals on the table, which seems to point towards a no deal, but who knows.

I think trade will sort itself out but for me I would expect a clear exit from the auspices of the EU, some vague entanglement in EU regulation to help continued seamless trade in some sectors I doubt would bother me.
Click to expand...

So you are hoping for a solution which hasn't even been alluded to yet, but think 'trade' will sort itself out. And if it doesn't you accept that we are completely unprepared for any alternatives.

You're not exactly inspiring confidence, and you are one of the more lucid Brexiteers on here.

My experience is if it looks like a f*** up, smells like a f*** up and sounds like a f*** up, then it's probably a f*** up that is staring us smack bang in the face. And no matter how many times you shut your eyes, it will still be there when you open them.

Until someone does something about it :shrug:
 
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D

daveinprague

New member
Oct 1, 2009
12,572
Prague, Czech Republic
BigGully said:
You're being daft, I am being honest, I cannot know and you certainly can't.

The next day, as I understand it we would be on WTO terms wouldn't we ?

Are you saying this will make our economy crash ?

If so I will counter that by saying I don't think it will .......
Click to expand...


Yes, WTO with harmful tariffs... the highest tariffs in fact.
How about transport? European driving licenses, European insurance for haulage in the EU (that you cannot obtain in the UK) . Im sure haulage companies are looking forward to enormous hikes in their premiums, particularly the small ones.
 






WATFORD zero

WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,747
BigGully said:
You're being daft, I am being honest, I cannot know and you certainly can't.

The next day, as I understand it we would be on WTO terms wouldn't we ?
..
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No, you can't fall out onto WTO terms. The only WTO terms that we currently have in place are our EU ones. We submitted our proposals 2-3 weeks ago which basically said that we would like the same as we had under the EU.

Within 3 days, the US, New Zealand and Brazil had said no. I haven't kept up to date with the current situation, but the other 164 members have 90 days to come back with any issues they have and we then have to negotiate from there, with any member who has raised issues.

(As a general rule, the WTO likes you to have borders and customs as well :))

But, on the bright side, we still have 7 months and 1 week to do it all
 
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Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
62,677
The Fatherland
seagulls4ever said:
Can you respond to the question about the Greek votes?
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You’re asking a rhetorical question, so there’s no need. Say what you want to say, you don’t need me to cue you up.
 




B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
daveinprague said:
How about transport? European driving licenses, European insurance for haulage in the EU.
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If the EU and the UK are not reasonable enough to ensure a continuation of driving licences or insurances between them, then which ever is the antagonist deserves our indignation, is this a real concern for you ?
 


B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
WATFORD zero said:
No, you can't fall out onto WTO terms. The only WTO terms that we currently have in place are our EU ones. We submitted our proposals 2-3 weeks ago which basically said that we would like the same as we had under the EU.

Within 3 days, the US, New Zealand and Brazil had said no. I haven't kept up to date with the current situation, but the other 164 member have 90 days to come back with any issues they have and we then have to negotiate from there, with any member who has raised issues.

(As a general rule, the WTO likes you to have borders and customs as well :)
Click to expand...

So do you think trade would cease to happen, or some might cease where others wont or no trade will cease but it would be an administrative nightmare, what do you think ?

I find it hard to accept that the UK would suddenly suffer trade paralysis.
 


B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
Garry Nelson's teacher said:
"I think trade will sort itself out...……….."


Well that's a problem overcome without too much bother, then.
Click to expand...

Interestingly it overcome the referendum ok didn't it ?

Yours could be a post from pre June 2016, it's another example of you not seeing a positive outcome no matter what.
 




WATFORD zero

WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,747
BigGully said:
So do you think trade would cease to happen, or some might cease where others wont or no trade will cease but it would be an administrative nightmare, what do you think ?

I find it hard to accept that the UK would suddenly suffer trade paralysis.
Click to expand...

If you think that 'no deal' is some sort of fallback, then you have been taken in (not for the first time) by some less than honest politicians. It is far more complex, and entails a whole new set of negotiations with various trading blocs (including, of course, the EU). Every other member of the WTO are part of a trade bloc. We will be the only member trying to negotiate independently.

That is also completely ignoring the infrastructure changes needed for us to operate as an independent country.

The costs and lead times of the various negotiations and infrastructure meant that it would have been a tough job to get it in place if we had started the day after the referendum.
 


D

daveinprague

New member
Oct 1, 2009
12,572
Prague, Czech Republic
BigGully said:
If the EU and the UK are not reasonable enough to ensure a continuation of driving licences or insurances between them, then which ever is the antagonist deserves our indignation, is this a real concern for you ?
Click to expand...

The concern for me is possibly throwing the country down the toilet on the basis of...perhaps, maybe, possibly, what could happen is....
Its nothing to do with being an antagonist, or not. The rules are there in place for the EU. They have been there since day 1 of triggering article 51 and havnt changed.
You 'believe' the EU will change its structure to accommodate an easy time for the UK? Come on man.
 


B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
ManOfSussex said:
It's good to know isn't it. Just need to let The FTA, The RHA, Kent County Council, Kent Police, HMRC, UKBF etc, etc know that they're all worrying over nothing.
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In business you find solutions, I sometimes wonder what jobs you guys have, you seem averse to change almost as if we are currently in the promised land, lets see if those mentioned continue to worry once we have left, probably not.
 


Baldseagull

Baldseagull

Well-known member
Jan 26, 2012
11,839
Crawley
BigGully said:
You dont really think what was relevant 40+ years ago should somehow dictate how we feel today, by all means argue the toss that it is still a valid point, but I dont agree.
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I think the economic argument is well covered on these pages, I admit you have to filter out some mudslinging and jibes, but there is no sound economic argument for leaving the EU in the way that is talked about by those leading the charge. If we left to be like Norway, it might work for us better, but that kicks the sovereignty argument hard in the nuts, and the control of borders, and still gives us a border that needs enforcing between NI and Eire.
 




B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
daveinprague said:
The concern for me is possibly throwing the country down the toilet on the basis of...perhaps, maybe, possibly, what could happen is....
Its nothing to do with being an antagonist, or not. The rules are there in place for the EU. They have been there since day 1 of triggering article 51 and havnt changed.
You 'believe' the EU will change its structure to accommodate an easy time for the UK? Come on man.
Click to expand...

It was you that mentioned driving licensed and haulage insurance, I lived in the USA and could drive and insure myself as I have in the EU, it surprises how you expect me to think this might be a likely problem.
 


D

daveinprague

New member
Oct 1, 2009
12,572
Prague, Czech Republic
BigGully said:
It was you that mentioned driving licensed and haulage insurance, I lived in the USA and could drive and insure myself as I have in the EU, it surprises how you expect me to think this might be a likely problem.
Click to expand...

That is because the UK is currently in the EU which has bilateral agreements. When we leave the EU, we will not be in the EU and will not be part of any bilateral agreement.
 


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