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  1. D

    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    Refusing to gamble with human lives is fear? That's a little insulting. And there was me thinking they had the right to those lives...
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    I think you are dead wrong here (pun genuinely not intended). If you have a life threatening disease or illness they are one and the same. You are ill/injured, gravely, and the only chance of maintaining your life (that you have a right to) is to pay someone to save you. If you can't afford it...
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    The thing is, my point here isn't that this is an obligation. My point that everyone has the right to healthcare of course is based on the assumption that there people willing to work as doctors as their "labour", to use your terminology. The point of highlighting this contradiction (that maybe...
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    Online, phone up, or queue up?

    Sorted. Spurs ticket acquired - online. Now it'll probably turn out we don't sell 17,000 and this panic was all for nothing :lolol:
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    Owen Garvan (merged)

    I had indeed missed that - thanks. Will keep an eye out for the news. To be honest, I'm skeptical that you can get £5m for him, but time will tell and I'll happily (well, willingly) apologise if it happens.
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    Strange analogy. Your example would be a better fit to having the right to your own body, whether you are dead or alive. If your car breaks down and I don't fix it, it is still your car - it just won't get you anywhere. If you die from an injury that I won't heal, your life is gone. Unless...
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    Owen Garvan (merged)

    Sorry - I've missed this news story too. Where is it?
  8. D

    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    I absolutely don't think that everything is opinion. What I (and others) have said is that when it comes to rights, you have been claiming your opinion as fact / "self-evident" when it is not. :facepalm: Either you do have the right to your life, or not. If another (any/all other person/s)...
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    Owen Garvan (merged)

    Strange that Leicester didn't snap him up then rather than splash £5m on Matthew Mills. Unless, of course, I've missed the news story about you turning the down £5m for Clyne?
  10. D

    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    Well, that was half of my point - once you accept what you have written above, you suddenly don't have your right to life. It's possible to save it, but not a right. Hence... no right to life. No? To explain - you yourself are stating that your arguments are "self-evident", and "not opinion"...
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    Do you not see that there is a contradiction there? If you have a life-threatening disease/injury that another human being has the ability to cure/heal, and you do not have the right to that treatment, then your right to life is suddenly not there. Either you do, or you do not, have the right to...
  12. D

    Murdoch withdraws BSkyB bid

    Is it just me that thinks the true headline is "Murdoch withdraws BSkyB bid... for now"? He'll be back after the dust has settled, I reckon - however long that may take.
  13. D

    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    I do not disagree with these sentences at all This I do not agree with. You named, specifically, the "right to life". I just don't understand: a) How you, from your viewpoint, can so categorically distinguish between "the right to life" and "the right to healthcare". Doesn't one imply the...
  14. D

    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    Maybe you could help me out here. A "natural" right to say what we think? A "natural" right to the fruits of our labour? Really? Does the universe round on those who take them away? If you work and someone steals your wages/food, who is it protects you? The universe, or the society that gives...
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    I have genuinely tried to be perfectly polite in this debate. However yes, I do concede that I have snapped. Seeing you avoid answering questions, and then state the bare-faced lie that you do not avoid answering questions made me snap. In the interest of honesty, I believe lying to be just as...
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    Simply unbelievable. Another simple Yes or No question that you fail to either answer "Yes" or "No" to. Try again? Under the current system, every citizen will have access to equal treatment. Some treatments may not be purchased by the NHS if they are both expensive and unproven, but that does...
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    FFS. And you denied earlier that you avoid/refuse to answer questions. Of course there are problems with that, but that is a completely separate argument. YOU said rights are natural, so we asked you to name an example of such a "natural" right. Please stop ignoring the questions - or at least...
  18. D

    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    But it would not be universal. Do you, or do you not, accept this? (I don't mean a minority, a small majority, or even a massive majority would have it. I mean universal.)
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    The NHS really is something to be proud of.

    I read this to mean they've somehow evolved, and/or all of nature (i.e. every plant/animal would recognise them). Could you name a single right that exists "naturally" in this way?
  20. D

    Owen Garvan (merged)

    Quite. Was thinking the same thing about Ryan Giggs - Wales didn't qualify, so him not being at the WC must mean he's terrible and worse than everybody in the Australian team. :jester:

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