[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

marlowe · 2025-02-26T21:18:10+0000

Eric the meek said:

Its just more rambling without saying anything definitive. He can't even finish any of the sentences he starts because as soon as he starts speaking he realises he hasn't got anything of any consequence to say so before it goes anywhere he switches tack to some other inconsequential inanety.

He's also rather stating the obvious when he says he thinks that Putin wanted the whole of Ukraine, but he says it as if he's saying something really insightful that hasn't occurred to anyone else.

He basically hasnt got a clue what's going to happen as far as Putin is concerned as he has no influence over him despite what he's so desperate for us to think.

Sirnormangall · 2025-02-26T21:19:57+0000

vegster said:
Well, lets agree to take Ukraine in to NATO and allow the US to leave. Sod him.

…or suspend US membership until the US gets a new and sane president!

raymondo · 2025-02-26T21:24:03+0000

Eric the meek said:
On the eastern side of the Black Sea at Tuapse, near the Georgian 'breakaway' region of Abkhazia

Keep it going, Ukraine, nobody else has taken over your security yet.

essbee1 · 2025-02-26T21:29:07+0000

raymondo said:
Keep it going, Ukraine, nobody else has taken over your security yet.

Get into 'em, f*** 'em up!

Scappa · 2025-02-26T21:35:48+0000

Eric the meek said:
On the eastern side of the Black Sea at Tuapse, near the Georgian 'breakaway' region of Abkhazia

This thread needs less Trump, more bavovna

raymondo · 2025-02-26T21:50:13+0000

I can't see this working. Russia says no NATO troops in Ukraine, ok I know NATO or those countries unilaterally can ignore that, but I believe Russia would attack them in pockets.
I can't see a secure ceasefire at the moment, just can't.
Keep droning those refineries!

Eric the meek · 2025-02-26T21:56:51+0000

Scappa said:
This thread needs less Trump, more bavovna

Agreed. You know where you are with bavovnas.

I forgot to say, Tuapse is just along the coast from Putin's Black Sea Palace at Geleshnik (sp). Apparently, there's a nightclub in it.

GoldstoneVintage · 2025-02-26T22:32:56+0000

raymondo said:
I can't see this working. Russia says no NATO troops in Ukraine, ok I know NATO or those countries unilaterally can ignore that, but I believe Russia would attack them in pockets.
I can't see a secure ceasefire at the moment, just can't.
Keep droning those refineries!

I don't think a ceasefire serves Ukraine's long term interests at this time. The best thing they can do (imho) is to protect their people whilst building up military strength and continuing to bleed the Russian army and economy. Do this and Russia will be incapable of carrying on the war in the near future and have to withdraw.

peterward · 2025-02-26T23:10:27+0000

Triggaaar said:
This is confusing. BBC news on the radio say that they've agreed a deal - this quote above says they've agreed a deal - and then the same piece goes on to say they won't sign it. If they won't sign a deal, then they haven't agreed a deal

From what Ive seen this evening.... "The deal" is more of a framework on the Ukrainian side, with some of the main facets, like the fund and contribution %'s agreed, but a lot of the finer details still to be concluded?

The Ukrainians are still pressing for Security guarantees, and it says Zelenskyy will push Trump on Friday about whether he will or wont continue to support Ukraine militarily, and the outcome of his meeting with Trump will determine the success of the deal.

So best guess, is a lot of the general fundamentals are agreed, but its still not enough for Ukraine without the security guarantees or ongoing US support?

Would be pretty bold to turn up in Washington, meet Trump, not get the security guarantees he wants, so bin it off and leave Washington!

Triggaaar · 2025-02-26T23:15:32+0000

peterward said:
From what Ive seen this evening.... "The deal" is more of a framework on the Ukrainian side, with some of the main facets, like the fund and contribution %'s agreed, but a lot of the finer details still to be concluded?

Yep, that's how it looks to me.

peterward said:
Would be pretty bold to turn up in Washington, meet Trump, not get the security guarantees he wants, so bin it off and leave Washington!

Yeah I'm not convinced that going to the US is a good idea. Trump won't offer Zelenskyy what he wants, and Trump will be embarrassed (and therefore react) if Zelenskyy leaves without signing anything.

SeagullinExile · 2025-02-26T23:29:52+0000

Eric the meek said:
I think I get this. I assume this is a 'pre-agreement' to publish their agreement on the minerals deal, subject to the inclusion of a security guarantee which, if it exists yet, will remain classified and well away from Russian eyes.

If. If this is correct, then boy is it interesting, for it may mean that Trump is on the side of Ukraine.

Yes, I'm guilty of wishful thinking. But the security guarantee has always been left out, because it is classified. Is Zelensky in on it?

Trump is only on the side of Trump. He’ll probably strike a deal for minerals with Russia too....in Russian occupied Donbass.

peterward · 2025-02-27T00:00:07+0000

Eric the meek said:
On the eastern side of the Black Sea at Tuapse, near the Georgian 'breakaway' region of Abkhazia

I'll take your Bavova and raise you 160000 tons of 122mm! It is a few months older admittedly

giveusfalmerplease · 2025-02-27T00:05:44+0000

Hopefully Zelensky signs whatever papers Trump puts in front of him. Nothing gets paid until the war is over. Then when the US comes with the begging bowl to start being repaid Zelensky can tell Trump to "do one". Whats Trump gonna do? Invade Ukraine? lol

peterward · 2025-02-27T06:47:57+0000

Interesting article on the vastly inflated US aid numbers...... arguing true totals are significantly less.

Comprehensively Valuing Ukraine Aid – An Economic Approach – Economists for Ukraine

econ4ua.org

vegster · 2025-02-27T07:00:42+0000

So today we have the re-run of 1939, Adolf Hitler will be played by Donald Trump and Sir Keir Starmer debuts as Neville Chamberlain...

peterward · 2025-02-27T07:06:27+0000

vegster said:
So today we have the re-run of 1939, Adolf Hitler will be played by Donald Trump and Sir Keir Starmer debuts as Neville Chamberlain...

I feel certain that two tier won't be as strident as Macron, face to face.

He does his tough talk in national press via his press secretary, in the room, he'll be a weak nodding yes man imho.

armchairclubber · 2025-02-27T07:08:32+0000

vegster said:
So today we have the re-run of 1939, Adolf Hitler will be played by Donald Trump and Sir Keir Starmer debuts as Neville Chamberlain...

Has he prepared his country for war?

Eric the meek · 2025-02-27T07:16:03+0000

peterward said:
I'll take your Bavova and raise you 160000 tons of 122mm! It is a few months older admittedly

I read that the Toropets Angel was the biggest non nuclear explosion in the war, or maybe ever.

Eric the meek · 2025-02-27T07:27:39+0000

marlowe said:
Its just more rambling without saying anything definitive. He can't even finish any of the sentences he starts because as soon as he starts speaking he realises he hasn't got anything of any consequence to say so before it goes anywhere he switches tack to some other inconsequential inanety.

He's also rather stating the obvious when he says he thinks that Putin wanted the whole of Ukraine, but he says it as if he's saying something really insightful that hasn't occurred to anyone else.

He basically hasnt got a clue what's going to happen as far as Putin is concerned as he has no influence over him despite what he's so desperate for us to think.

'He basically hasn't got a clue what's going to happen'.

I think it's also true he basically hasn't got a clue what he's going to say next.

He's winging it. There's no plan.

raymondo · 2025-02-27T07:36:12+0000

Triggaaar said:
Yep, that's how it looks to me.

Yeah I'm not convinced that going to the US is a good idea. Trump won't offer Zelenskyy what he wants, and Trump will be embarrassed (and therefore react) if Zelenskyy leaves without signing anything.

That's my feeling too.
If Zelenskiy goes to Washington on a half promise, Trump and his cronies will pressure him with public announcements, then quite possibly row back on the 'promise'. =Nasty situation.
Zelenskiy needs to go with a good support team because Trump will have his 12 circled around him.

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[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

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