[Football] Parental advice needed for a father of a 14 year old ref.

Guinness Boy · Monday at 12:09 PM

Commander said:
Have to say I've never really witnessed this in kids football yet. We are only at under 11's I guess. I've seen the coaches squaring up to other coaches / parents but apart from the odd shouting appeal to the ref for a penalty or something, I haven't really seen any abuse.

Like with many things in football (diving, time-wasting etc) if the authorities really cared, and really wanted it eradicated, they could do it very quickly. I think it's too much to expect a 14 year old to red card fully grown male coaches and abandon the game if he's getting abused, but if he was getting abused then once the game has finished and he's gone home away from the coaches and parents, he should just be able to award a 3-0 victory to the opposition. They'd find out later that day and there wouldn't need to be a confrontation on the pitch or after the game. It would stop fairly quickly once teams started losing every game.

You'll get there. I hope you don't but expect you will.

When I was coaching U9 and U10s the ref was very often a kid from a higher age group of the home club. The home club provided the referee most of the time and it was understood to be best endeavours.

The problems start at older ages with organised league football (even though results are not officially published). So suddenly I was at an under 13 game my son was playing in when two sets of parents, two coaches and a bloke in a mobility scooter who all represented a club who shall remain nameless and called Newhaven, confronted the referee on the pitch at half time over one decision. We then had to escort the young ref off the pitch at the end to help him get to his lift.

I think it starts to happen at an age when the parents suddenly realise that little Jaydon isn't going to be buying them a mansion in the next 10 years after all.

However, while I have every sympathy with young refs such as those in the OP, some of the older ones really don't help themselves. One old boy in our league never left the centre circle, insisting he could see everything perfectly well from there. Another gave the kids a lecture before hand that was just a set of meaningless platitudes, such that all 22 kids were laughing at him before the game kicked off. Another time a club supplied a 'linesman' who must have been at least 25 stone and didn't move all game.

I do understand, of course, that some of these mad old boys still have to do it because of the abuse the young ones get and because they have a sense of duty and responsibility that comes with the best volunteers. But still......

Kinky Gerbil · Monday at 1:56 PM

Guinness Boy said:
You'll get there. I hope you don't but expect you will.

When I was coaching U9 and U10s the ref was very often a kid from a higher age group of the home club. The home club provided the referee most of the time and it was understood to be best endeavours.

The problems start at older ages with organised league football (even though results are not officially published). So suddenly I was at an under 13 game my son was playing in when two sets of parents, two coaches and a bloke in a mobility scooter who all represented a club who shall remain nameless and called Newhaven, confronted the referee on the pitch at half time over one decision. We then had to escort the young ref off the pitch at the end to help him get to his lift.

I think it starts to happen at an age when the parents suddenly realise that little Jaydon isn't going to be buying them a mansion in the next 10 years after all.

However, while I have every sympathy with young refs such as those in the OP, some of the older ones really don't help themselves. One old boy in our league never left the centre circle, insisting he could see everything perfectly well from there. Another gave the kids a lecture before hand that was just a set of meaningless platitudes, such that all 22 kids were laughing at him before the game kicked off. Another time a club supplied a 'linesman' who must have been at least 25 stone and didn't move all game.

I do understand, of course, that some of these mad old boys still have to do it because of the abuse the young ones get and because they have a sense of duty and responsibility that comes with the best volunteers. But still......

I do wonder how many of these older ones are carrying on because they are being asked to by the league themselves, in my last season of playing 11 aside they communicated the lack of refs meant some games would need to be postponed or cancelled and they had asked some older refs to stay on/back who planned of quitting.

As you've said it all comes from younger people not wanting to do it anymore, I certainly wouldn't do it again (a few of us were paid for via Hassocks when at u16s) , not worth the hassle

Bet the same chavs on a Saturday screaming at a 14 year old wonders why the standard of officials is dropping

Milano · Monday at 2:57 PM

I look forward to watching my sons play cricket for 3 months, I dread the 9 months of football, purely because of these feral parents. The wife has stopped coming to the football for this reason.

Some refs do not help themselves though, yesterday the ref decided to blow a good 5 minutes short of FT. Our coach, the oppo's coach, both linesmen, and some parents all agreed this. Literally circa 10 individuals representing BOTH teams, what does the ref do? Doubles down, his watch is correct, everyone elses is wrong. And off he went. He'd actually been a good ref but the lasting memory is of him being a pompous tit.

dazzer6666 · Monday at 3:08 PM

Commander said:
Have to say I've never really witnessed this in kids football yet. We are only at under 11's I guess. I've seen the coaches squaring up to other coaches / parents but apart from the odd shouting appeal to the ref for a penalty or something, I haven't really seen any abuse.

Like with many things in football (diving, time-wasting etc) if the authorities really cared, and really wanted it eradicated, they could do it very quickly. I think it's too much to expect a 14 year old to red card fully grown male coaches and abandon the game if he's getting abused, but if he was getting abused then once the game has finished and he's gone home away from the coaches and parents, he should just be able to award a 3-0 victory to the opposition. They'd find out later that day and there wouldn't need to be a confrontation on the pitch or after the game. It would stop fairly quickly once teams started losing every game.

That age is largely below the cusp of where it can start to get ugly in my experience.................I've seen parents fighting in a car park, parents near-assaulting kids that were playing, red-faced parents screaming at refs and linos and once seen the police called because things got so out of hand (was only spectating thankfully).

Agree re 14 year-old refs dealing with adults. Not sure what's happening to the bodycam idea but not a bad idea imo - any parental abuse and the game is stopped or dealt with as you say and the footage supplied to the local FA and the club sanctioned.

We were lucky - we had a good set of parents and lads in the main. We stopped one game after the ref failed to turn up, one of our guys agreed to do it on the full understanding he wasn't qualified and would do his best (bottom line was all the kids have turned up and just want to play football) but he started getting dogs abuse from a couple of oppo parents, and instead of the coach telling them to button it, he joined in. :shrug:

hans kraay fan club · Monday at 3:22 PM

dazzer6666 said:
That age is largely below the cusp of where it can start to get ugly in my experience.................I've seen parents fighting in a car park, parents near-assaulting kids that were playing, red-faced parents screaming at refs and linos and once seen the police called because things got so out of hand (was only spectating thankfully).

Agree re 14 year-old refs dealing with adults. Not sure what's happening to the bodycam idea but not a bad idea imo - any parental abuse and the game is stopped or dealt with as you say and the footage supplied to the local FA and the club sanctioned.

We were lucky - we had a good set of parents and lads in the main. We stopped one game after the ref failed to turn up, one of our guys agreed to do it on the full understanding he wasn't qualified and would do his best (bottom line was all the kids have turned up and just want to play football) but he started getting dogs abuse from a couple of oppo parents, and instead of the coach telling them to button it, he joined in.

I must have reffed around 20 of my two lads' matches as they grew up (and ran the line about a MILLION times). Reffed games from U11 up as far as U16.

I was not not a qualified ref (ironically, both of my lads are / were) but did it because the alternative was no game.

The little kids are easy tbh - there is still a level of respect / fear of adults that means they don't question you. U15 / U16 was hard - most especially when you are not a 'proper ref' and they know you are not. I think they feel that gives them more leeway to question your authority. they also know that any cards you dish out, are not going to go through to the FA.

I always had a 30 second chat with each team and their coach ahead of the game, along the lines of "I do not want to be doing this. I'm doing it because I have to, so that you can play your game. Please accept I am doing my best and making decisions as I see them'.

Mostly I found they were receptive of that - and I only ever had to (temporarily) stop a game once. One kid had shown a fair bit of dissent, and crossed a line into directly calling me a name. I stopped the game, walked him over to his manager, and with my cards in my hand, asked him if he were just about to make a substitution...

GT49er · Monday at 4:44 PM

hans kraay fan club said:
I must have reffed around 20 of my two lads' matches as they grew up (and ran the line about a MILLION times). Reffed games from U11 up as far as U16.

I was not not a qualified ref (ironically, both of my lads are / were) but did it because the alternative was no game.

The little kids are easy tbh - there is still a level of respect / fear of adults that means they don't question you. U15 / U16 was hard - most especially when you are not a 'proper ref' and they know you are not. I think they feel that gives them more leeway to question your authority. they also know that any cards you dish out, are not going to go through to the FA.

I always had a 30 second chat with each team and their coach ahead of the game, along the lines of "I do not want to be doing this. I'm doing it because I have to, so that you can play your game. Please accept I am doing my best and making decisions as I see them'.

Mostly I found they were receptive of that - and I only ever had to (temporarily) stop a game once. One kid had shown a fair bit of dissent, and crossed a line into directly calling me a name. I stopped the game, walked him over to his manager, and with my cards in my hand, asked him if he were just about to make a substitution...

Did he?

UnhingedSeagull94 · Monday at 4:53 PM

Peacehaven Wild Kids said:
How do I play this? My 14 year old refereeing son has just left the field of play virtually in tears after receiving shit loads of criticism from both coaches this morning in a kids match.

Do I a) get him to dust himself down, encourage him to take it on the chin, tell him how he’s doing a great job under difficult circumstances (I.e working with 2 unqualified sometimes bias linos) and remind him how proud we are of him while still learning his trade doing an important role in a game he loves, and teach him the value of toughening up and taking the rough with the smooth.

or

b) email the league and tell them to shove it up their arses, it’s not worth the fuckin aggro.?

I’m 56 years old I’m seriously learning towards option b)

Is option a) a better choice?

Thanks in advance

Do a bit of A and B! A encourages your son to keep persevering. B helps stamp out abuse at grass roots level football. It’s not grassing on anyone it’s merely what you have witnessed.

Peacehaven Wild Kids · Monday at 5:40 PM

UnhingedSeagull94 said:
Do a bit of A and B! A encourages your son to keep persevering. B helps stamp out abuse at grass roots level football. It’s not grassing on anyone it’s merely what you have witnessed.

Thank you for taking the time to reply, just to say this is a bounced post from the start of the year.
To keep it short, I DID create a shitstorm and action was taken. He’s continued and is generally doing ok but I tend to protect him more by making myself more visible, not sure what I can do when he takes the step up, like his mate who is now 16 and running the line at county league men’s matches.

Sadly though, across the country the subject matter is being repeated every Sunday morning

Cotton Socks · Monday at 5:59 PM

Peacehaven Wild Kids said:
Thank you, yes, this message needs repeating constantly.
On a personal level this season things have been better but I have paid closer to the proceedings (as opposed to walking the dog, going for a cup of coffee)
One incident he did report was Gatwick Warriors FC playing down at Telscombe (my wife was there I was working)
The abuse he got, when explaining it to me said he thought they were pissed (a10a.m kick off) as there seemed no other logical explanation.
The home team also reported them to the league, but we haven’t heard anything.

Anyhoo he’s had a couple of good matches on the bounce and also a new found love of vinyl
so he puts up with shit as he now regularly puts his match fee over the counter at Resident Records the following day

Glad things are a bit better for him.

My son is going to be happy to know that someone else under the age of 18 knows what vinyl is! What music is he into, is he trying to learn to mix? Top tip don't let him get into OldSkool rave hardcore, as much as I loved it and still do, in about 20 mins my son is going to have a mix. That's going to mean 2 hours of bass coming through the ceiling. I don't want to discourage him as he's getting quite good with tunes that are hard to mix as there's a lot going on in them, but after about 45 mins (especially if he's trying a particular mix & I have to listen to the same tracks over and over). It's very tempting to go to the fuse board & turn off the upstairs plug sockets! :lolol:

On the plus side he's learnt to adjust the mixer so that the sound is level when he's bringing the next track in & he has his own decks so he's not driving me loopy using mine in the lounge anymore (that was way too much to handle).

Harry Wilson's tackle · Monday at 6:00 PM

Peacehaven Wild Kids said:
Thank you for taking the time to reply, just to say this is a bounced post from the start of the year.
To keep it short, I DID create a shitstorm and action was taken. He’s continued and is generally doing ok but I tend to protect him more by making myself more visible, not sure what I can do when he takes the step up, like his mate who is now 16 and running the line at county league men’s matches.

Sadly though, across the country the subject matter is being repeated every Sunday morning

It may take a few subject features on Nicky Campbell, and maybe some undercover filming and a TV programme, but action will happen. If people make it so.

In the 70s people laughed when it was suggested that calling people by racial and homophobic slurs in the workplace would eventually be stamped out.....

Peacehaven Wild Kids · Monday at 6:13 PM

Cotton Socks said:
Glad things are a bit better for him.

My son is going to be happy to know that someone else under the age of 18 knows what vinyl is! What music is he into, is he trying to learn to mix? Top tip don't let him get into OldSkool rave hardcore, as much as I loved it and still do, in about 20 mins my son is going to have a mix. That's going to mean 2 hours of bass coming through the ceiling. I don't want to discourage him as he's getting quite good with tunes that are hard to mix as there's a lot going on in them, but after about 45 mins (especially if he's trying a particular mix & I have to listen to the same tracks over and over). It's very tempting to go to the fuse board & turn off the upstairs plug sockets!
On the plus side he's learnt to adjust the mixer so that the sound is level when he's bringing the next track in & he has his own decks so he's not driving me loopy using mine in the lounge anymore (that was way too much to handle).

Firstly cheers.

He’s gone it alone with music recently, initially when he was young it was Belle & Sebastian and Sparks, now he’s absolutely obsessed by Fontaines DC, he also really likes The Smile. Black Country New Road and Geordie Greep. He’s not doing any mixing as it hasn’t come up, and he wasn’t a fan of hip hop and the like however his latest thing is Kneecap so we’ll see how this unfolds

Papak · Monday at 6:32 PM

Peacehaven Wild Kids said:
Firstly cheers.

He’s gone it alone with music recently, initially when he was young it was Belle & Sebastian and Sparks, now he’s absolutely obsessed by Fontaines DC, he also really likes The Smile. Black Country New Road and Geordie Greep. He’s not doing any mixing as it hasn’t come up, and he wasn’t a fan of hip hop and the like however his latest thing is Kneecap so we’ll see how this unfolds

Any chance of a translation for an old git?

Cotton Socks · Monday at 6:41 PM

Peacehaven Wild Kids said:
Firstly cheers.

He’s gone it alone with music recently, initially when he was young it was Belle & Sebastian and Sparks, now he’s absolutely obsessed by Fontaines DC, he also really likes The Smile. Black Country New Road and Geordie Greep. He’s not doing any mixing as it hasn’t come up, and he wasn’t a fan of hip hop and the like however his latest thing is Kneecap so we’ll see how this unfolds

Nope, I did not have to Google all of them aside from Soarks!

After a quick listen to Kneecap I feel I have the better deal! :lolol:

Peacehaven Wild Kids · Monday at 6:46 PM

Cotton Socks said:
Nope, I did not have to Google all of them aside from Soarks! After a quick listen to Kneecap I feel I have the better deal!

Well I’ve actually warmed to them as I’ve mentioned on one of the music threads. Bizarre as I’m 57 so I’m probably about 40 years too old

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[Football] Parental advice needed for a father of a 14 year old ref.

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