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[Football] Mohammed 'Al' Fayed



R

rippleman

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2011
4,988
Flounce said:
OK, thanks but nobody has given me a valid reason why any of these poor women stayed at Harrods for years after the offences. I genuinely don’t understand it :shrug:
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For probably the same reason that women who suffer abuse in a domestic situation very often don't leave (or pursue complaints). As stated by The Clamp:

Coercion. Manipulation. Fear. Control. Threats.

And the more money and power a man has, the easier Coercion. Manipulation. Fear. Control. Threats. become.
 




R

ROSM

Well-known member
Dec 26, 2005
6,803
Just far enough away from LDC
Flounce said:
OK, thanks but nobody has given me a valid reason why any of these poor women stayed at Harrods for years after the offences. I genuinely don’t understand it :shrug:
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So who died and made you god today?

'Nobody has given  you a valid reason" ? Just read that back and realise how daft that sounds.
 


G

Glawstergull

Well-known member
May 21, 2004
1,074
GLAWSTERSHIRE
Surely the real question is why didn't ONE of them get clear and make enough noise to get this in the open.

Please excuse me if this was the case. The thread seems to have got a bit tit for tat.
 


L

Littlemo

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2022
1,699
Flounce said:
Would you have gone back to a place of work if you’d been raped? I get not saying anything but I don’t get why you’d ever go back/not quit. Some of these women were there for bloody years!
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In this case. He was an owner, so probably not someone they saw everyday, if it happened because it was a one off visit by him or it was a work event elsewhere, they may not even really relate it to the everyday workplace.

I had the experience of being minorly assaulted at a work event, the boss kept touching my knee, putting their hand on my legs etc. I was pretty uncomfortable and kept moving it away but it was bloody annoying. The funny thing is because the boss was a woman (I am also a woman) nobody ever believes that it was an assault. In the same way though, she was a very senior person whom I never saw for months in end, so I had no issues in going to or being around the workplace. I am sure if it had been much more serious, it would be different and I would not have gone back.
 


aolstudios

aolstudios

Well-known member
Nov 30, 2011
5,311
brighton
Westdene Seagull said:
You either don't know a woman that has been raped and the dispair and complexities it brings or you live in cloud cuckoo land given how flippant you are about "just find another job".

You're also victim blaming by suggesting the victim should take the punishment of a lesser job or move abroad.
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This ^
& to anyone else posting similar
 






M

marlowe

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2015
4,297
Crawley Dingo said:
I was talking to a former CEO of a top company about Strauss-khan the chambermaid rapist and he laughed and said "We've known about his antics for years", for every Saville etc there are dozens who know and stay silent. That to me is almost as big as the crime.
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So why do you make exceptions when it's Trump who is being accused? Why do you pour such scorn on his accusers, of which there are numerous?

It's not just those "who know and stay silent" who enable, it's also those who publicly support the accused, (such as on Internet forums) , and seek to discredit and undermine the accusers.

That also serves to empower the abusers and inflict further damage on the victims. Surely you can see that given your comments in your post.

So while I agree with your comment, your defensive attitude when it comes to Trump's conduct towards women and your undermining of his victims exposes your insincerity and and lack of conviction in the point you made. Because in your own way you are also acting as an enabler and empowerer, just like the ones you condemn.
 






Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
67,961
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
Flounce said:
OK, thanks but nobody has given me a valid reason why any of these poor women stayed at Harrods for years after the offences. I genuinely don’t understand it :shrug:
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Threats to their families was another reason given. From what I am hearing now, the threats weren’t just from Al Fayed himself but his staff as well.
 


Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
67,961
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
Flounce said:
Bollocks. You think staying at the job where you have been assaulted or raped is your only option?

What a f***ing sad f***ed up world if you believe that and suggest there are zero alternatives.

Thanks for the insults though.
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It happens in police forces and armed forces. Many of the Met policemen being investigated were for raping their colleagues.

Women have learned to put up and shut up for centuries.
 


Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
67,961
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
Glawstergull said:
Surely the real question is why didn't ONE of them get clear and make enough noise to get this in the open.

Please excuse me if this was the case. The thread seems to have got a bit tit for tat.
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Complaints were made. This thread isn’t a definitive history.
 




Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
67,961
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
JBizzle said:
It's always amazing to me how quickly the question stops being "Why did this monster do these awful things?" to "Why didn't the victim just DO something?"...
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Yet if you question why the posters say that, it becomes defensive.
No victim should ever have to justify their actions.

I just hope those concerned don’t do jury duty.
 


clapham_gull

clapham_gull

Legacy Fan
Aug 20, 2003
25,886


clapham_gull

clapham_gull

Legacy Fan
Aug 20, 2003
25,886




Westdene Seagull

Westdene Seagull

aka Cap'n Carl Firecrotch
NSC Patron
Oct 27, 2003
21,534
The arse end of Hangleton
Flounce said:
Bollocks. You think staying at the job where you have been assaulted or raped is your only option?
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As well you know, that isn't what I said. You've been given plenty of reasons by a number of posters why a victim might stay ( women and men ) yet you still show a complete lack of understanding, awareness and empathy. There's no helping people like you.
 


clapham_gull

clapham_gull

Legacy Fan
Aug 20, 2003
25,886
Flounce said:
Point of interest, did you come across anything similar whilst in your acting/film career? Another area where this sort of thing seems to have happened? Much more difficult to walk away from/change career imo as it seems to be a passion for actors, unlike working in a department store.
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You understand how those big department stores worked / work ?

They aren't that many of them and part of the control is the victim would be very wary of getting a very bad reference and be described as "trouble".

He targeted the most vulnerable staff, those without the means (and family wealth) to instantly walk out.
 


Crawley Dingo

Crawley Dingo

Political thread tourist.
Mar 31, 2022
1,082
marlowe said:
So why do you make exceptions when it's Trump who is being accused? Why do you pour such scorn on his accusers, of which there are numerous?

It's not just those "who know and stay silent" who enable, it's also those who publicly support the accused, (such as on Internet forums) , and seek to discredit and undermine the accusers.

That also serves to empower the abusers and inflict further damage on the victims. Surely you can see that given your comments in your post.

So while I agree with your comment, your defensive attitude when it comes to Trump's conduct towards women and your undermining of his victims exposes your insincerity and and lack of conviction in the point you made. Because in your own way you are also acting as an enabler and empowerer, just like the ones you condemn.
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When the accusers are all of a political colour, when lawfare is being used against others as well as trump so this is not a straight or valid comparison.

I'm not defensive about Trump so much as on the attack against a corrupt left/establishment.

So because I make a post critical of those who remain silent about abuse I am aiding the abusers? Way to twist someone's words 180 degrees. Jog on fool.

Is this because I humiliated you in the last thread? :ROFLMAO:
 


dazzer6666

dazzer6666

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Mar 27, 2013
55,638
Burgess Hill
Glawstergull said:
Surely the real question is why didn't ONE of them get clear and make enough noise to get this in the open.

Please excuse me if this was the case. The thread seems to have got a bit tit for tat.
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It’s been in the open loads of times……..accusations, police investigations, CPS considering evidence etc etc.

www.bbc.co.uk

Mohamed al Fayed: Timeline of Harrods sexual predator

Here are some of the key moments and sex abuse claims amid Fayed’s almost 40-year reign at the top of his business empire.
www.bbc.co.uk
 




M

marlowe

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2015
4,297
Crawley Dingo said:
When the accusers are all of a political colour, when lawfare is being used against others as well as trump so this is not a straight or valid comparison.

I'm not defensive about Trump so much as on the attack against a corrupt left/establishment.

So because I make a post critical of those who remain silent about abuse I am aiding the abusers? Way to twist someone's words 180 degrees. Jog on fool.

Is this because I humiliated you in the last thread? :ROFLMAO:
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There is no evidence that all Trump's accusers are of the same left leaning political persuasion. They may be united in that they all now express anti Trump sentiments, but that has nothing to do with his politics, but rather to do with how they feel about him as a person because of what he did to them. Even if they were all staunch Republicans do you honestly believe they would still vote for him?

Jill Harth made her accusations against Trump in 1997, long before he entered politics, so that had nothing to do with political persuasion.

Alva Johnson, another of his many accusers, actually worked on Trump's 2016 presidential campaign, so she was presumably on the political right, not the "corrupt left" you mention.

I have no idea about the political allegiances of the other 24 or so women who have made allegations against him, and I doubt that you do either but feel free to enlighten me if you do.

So why are you trying to conflate political allegiance to the perpetration or accusation of sexual offences? It's ridiculous. Those on the political left have just as much potential to commit sexual offences as those on the right. Whatever my political allegiance I would be equally condemnatory of both. Sadly you are unable to make that separation or distinction, or at least not where Trump is concerned.

And to answer your question:... "So because I make a post critical of those who remain silent about abuse I am aiding the abusers?"... Don't be ridiculous. It's you who are twisting words 180 degrees as you put it, not me, as that's not remotely what I suggested. I was merely exposing your hypocrisy and double standards in your post. But you know that and it's your inability to offer a valid counter response that sees you having to resort to wilfully misinterpreting my words.

I evidently stated quite clearly that it was your unstilting defence against the many allegations of Trump's sexual offences and your denigration of his victims on a public forum which serves to empower Trump and inflict further harm on his victims.

Because while your solitary voice might be relatively insignificant you are in fact part of a unified larger mob like chorus all expressing similar repellent views, which is how people like you manage to inflict your damage on the victims and empower the abusers. You should be ashamed of yourself because it's precisely because of people like you why many victims don't feel empowered to come forward. You are part of the mob that keeps them cowering. That is why you are an enabler and empowerer of the abuse and the abuser.

And as for you humiliating me on another thread, I wasn't aware that you did. You'll have to try harder if that was your intention, because in any of our previous exchanges, which are thankfully very few, the only person that you managed to humiliate is yourself, but then you do seem particularly adept at self-humiliation.
 


Crawley Dingo

Crawley Dingo

Political thread tourist.
Mar 31, 2022
1,082
marlowe said:
There is no evidence that all Trump's accusers are of the same left leaning political persuasion. They may be united in that they all now express anti Trump sentiments, but that has nothing to do with his politics, but rather to do with how they feel about him as a person because of what he did to them. Even if they were all staunch Republicans do you honestly believe they would still vote for him?

Jill Harth made her accusations against Trump in 1997, long before he entered politics, so that had nothing to do with political persuasion.

Alva Johnson, another of his many accusers, actually worked on Trump's 2016 presidential campaign, so she was presumably on the political right, not the "corrupt left" you mention.

I have no idea about the political allegiances of the other 24 or so women who have made allegations against him, and I doubt that you do either but feel free to enlighten me if you do.

So why are you trying to conflate political allegiance to the perpetration or accusation of sexual offences? It's ridiculous. Those on the political left have just as much potential to commit sexual offences as those on the right. Whatever my political allegiance I would be equally condemnatory of both. Sadly you are unable to make that separation or distinction, or at least not where Trump is concerned.

And to answer your question:... "So because I make a post critical of those who remain silent about abuse I am aiding the abusers?"... Don't be ridiculous. It's you who are twisting words 180 degrees as you put it, not me, as that's not remotely what I suggested. I was merely exposing your hypocrisy and double standards in your post. But you know that and it's your inability to offer a valid counter response that sees you having to resort to wilfully misinterpreting my words.

I evidently stated quite clearly that it was your unstilting defence against the many allegations of Trump's sexual offences and your denigration of his victims on a public forum which serves to empower Trump and inflict further harm on his victims.

Because while your solitary voice might be relatively insignificant you are in fact part of a unified larger mob like chorus all expressing similar repellent views, which is how people like you manage to inflict your damage on the victims and empower the abusers. You should be ashamed of yourself because it's precisely because of people like you why many victims don't feel empowered to come forward. You are part of the mob that keeps them cowering. That is why you are an enabler and empowerer of the abuse and the abuser.

And as for you humiliating me on another thread, I wasn't aware that you did. You'll have to try harder if that was your intention, because in any of our previous exchanges, which are thankfully very few, the only person that you managed to humiliate is yourself, but then you do seem particularly adept at self-humiliation.
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TL DR
bye.
 


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