[Politics] Would YOU be happy to pay more income tax so OAPs could keep their fuel payments?

GT49er · Sep 14, 2024

Washie said:
Because they're told by employers, society, school, government, boomers that Uni is the only way to get a good job or else we'll end up at Macdonalds (pay higher than some roles that require a degree).

Agree to a point - but not with your list of villains of the piece. Many older nearly-boomers now don't encourage their children/grandchildren to go to university - we know from experience it doesn't always lead to earning big money, and the debt incurred is eye-watering, quite likely not worth it.
The real driving force is the legion of highly commercial former technical colleges, art colleges and catering colleges now fighting in a glorious free market for the lucrative business of awarding degrees.

Guinness Boy · Sep 14, 2024

Chicken Run said:
Would you be happy to pay for his removal?

10 grand ought to do it.

tigertim68 · Sep 14, 2024

Chicken Run said:
I would say there are plenty of pensioners who have never contributed anything to this country A quick look in Wisbech the other night on 24 hs in Police Custody was an example

They were not pensioners, and were exactly the type of people I am talking about

GT49er · Sep 14, 2024

Tom Hark Preston Park said:
Must be a bit more to it than that shirley else they could apply it automatically?

That could only tell you the people of pension age who are not getting pension credit; it won't show whether they are eligible to receive it though.

Stumpy Tim · Sep 14, 2024

Chicken Run said:
Slightly off topic but if youngsters are that hard done by with University fees and high interest rates on student loans why are there record numbers of young people year on year going to university?

According to the latest data from the Higher Education Statistics Agency (HESA), the percentage of 18-year-olds in England entering full-time higher education courses has steadily increased over the past two decades. In 2022, this figure reached 37.5%, representing the second-highest level on record.

Start a new thread

. It's a very different experience to when I went to Uni in the 1990's, that's for sure. My guess is more are likely living at home, and wonder what the figures are around which kids are going... i.e. less from working class background, more from those with money who can afford to pay. But that's guesswork

GT49er · Sep 14, 2024

sussex_guy2k2 said:
Unfortunately I don’t think this is a black and white, yes/no question. There’s too many variables at play. Which tax bracket are you talking about? All of them? Are we means testing this?

Yes, the tax brackets are means tested.

sussex_guy2k2 said:
Are we ensuring that everyone is paying the correct amount and that loopholes for the wealthy are being closed appropriately first?

No we're not, and this is certainly an area the government needs to work on.

sussex_guy2k2 said:
Are pensioners on final salary pensions being included in this?

Yes, they pay the same tax as if it was earned income.

sussex_guy2k2 said:
Is there cut off point where pensioners won’t receive this if they earn too much?

Pretty much yes; if you pay tax you won't be getting pension credit (or the winter fuel allowance), and vice versa.

timbha · Sep 14, 2024

Another 2p tax to fund WFA
Another 3p to mend the NHS
Another 1p to mend the roads
Another 2p for Ukraine
Another 2p to repair the schools
Another 5p to keep the unions happy
………
Where does it end?

nevergoagain · Sep 14, 2024

I would but not so it saves the government money to fund other costly initiatives I don't agree with. Difficult wider question as I'd happily pay more tax for effective policing, a better NHS for all etc. but I don't believe money is the only issue and you have to deal with mismanagement of existing resources at the same time. Huge amounts of wastage in all areas of the public sector.

Bry Nylon · Sep 14, 2024

The Antikythera Mechanism said:
It would be interesting if everyone had a lifetime balance sheet…

Somewhere deep inside the Accounting and Finance faculty at the University of Liverpool a klaxon sounds and a Dullard strokes his chin and opens a fresh Excel worksheet…

Peteinblack · Sep 14, 2024

portslade seagull said:
Have always said would happily pay more tax to fund the NHS, police and other services to the correct level

I agree, but with the proviso that the extra money actually goes on front-line staff, not the top-heavy bureaucracy in much of the public sector - there are too many managers who have often not done the job themselves, making damaging decisions on the basis of institutional strategies, arbitrary targets, and spreadsheets, and who are drowning nurses, police officers, social workers, and teachers, under paperwork and box-ticking.

For example, in universities, up to half of student fee income is spent on senior administrators and managers (Quality Officers, Alumni Officers, Assistant Deputy Deans of Outreach, etc), even while academics are being made redundant due to universities being £ millions in deficit (partly bankrupted because of the salaries of too many managers).

Guinness Boy · Sep 14, 2024

Triggaaar said:
Would it really cost as much as 2% for all of us, on all bands? I'm amazed that's how much the WFP cost.

The issue is that a lot of pensioners don't need it and can easily afford to go without it, whereas there are many more people who are scraping by, who can't afford 2% on the basic rate of tax.

The issue is everyone wants better public services and lower debt but no one wants to pay for it themselves.

Peteinblack · Sep 14, 2024

Guinness Boy said:
The issue is everyone wants better public services and lower debt but no one wants to pay for it themselves.

It's often said that we want a Scandinavian quality of public services, but only want to pay United States levels of tax!

When people say that "we pay too much tax", I often suspect that what they really mean is that they don't like paying tax - income tax in Britain is average when compared to tax rates in many other West European countries. The Scandinavian countries have the highest tax rates.

Triggaaar · Sep 14, 2024

Guinness Boy said:
The issue is everyone wants better public services and lower debt but no one wants to pay for it themselves.

It doesn't matter if people don't want to pay for it themselves, it's up to the government to make that decision.

You believe those with more can and should pay more and I agree, but 2% of the basic rate would see a lot of people who can't afford it having to pay.

Comrade Sam · Sep 14, 2024

Most of our incomes have been battered by inflation and paying ridiculous amounts on bills. Meanwhile the richest have seen a massive increase in their incomes, whilst their tax burden has fallen. Is it really the case we're not allowed to talk about taxing these bastards?
If we taxed billionaires an extra 10% they'd still be paying amongst the lowest tax rates for their incomes in the world. And 10% of their incomes is more than most can conceive (personally I'd like to see them return to 1970s levels of 80 & 90% then we'd be able to fund mono rails everywhere).
We need to put the kind of effort into making sure they pay up, than we put into clawing back pennies for benefit fraud.
Also most of the worlds tax havens belong to the UK, just shut them down. An extra 2% on the majority would cripple us financially and raises little compared to an extra 2% on the wealthiest and they'd not even have to consider changing internet provider and shopping at Aldi.
And the gas, electric, oil companies should be either contributing or we should stop contributing to their obscene profits.

nevergoagain · Sep 14, 2024

Peteinblack said:
I agree, but with the proviso that the extra money actually goes on front-line staff, not the top-heavy bureaucracy in much of the public sector - there are too many managers who have often not done the job themselves, making damaging decisions on the basis of institutional strategies, arbitrary targets, and spreadsheets, and who are drowning nurses, police officers, social workers, and teachers, under paperwork and box-ticking.

For example, in universities, up to half of student fee income is spent on senior administrators and managers (Quality Officers, Alumni Officers, Assistant Deputy Deans of Outreach, etc), even while academics are being made redundant due to universities being £ millions in deficit (partly bankrupted because of the salaries of too many managers).

A strange day where I agree with you totally on a post

Example £60k!!! - https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/candidate/j...iversity&language=en&skipPhraseSuggester=true

Peteinblack · Sep 14, 2024

timbha said:
Another 2p tax to fund WFA
Another 3p to mend the NHS
Another 1p to mend the roads
Another 2p for Ukraine
Another 2p to repair the schools
Another 5p to keep the unions happy
………
Where does it end?

Where have you got those figures from?

Hugo Rune · Sep 14, 2024

With the majority of WFP going to wealthy pensioners, absolutely not.

More than happy to pay extra if it was not universal and went to the estimated 800k who don’t have the agency to claim it.

Weststander · Sep 14, 2024

um bongo molongo said:
It’s not an either/or. We’ll be paying more taxes after October as well (CGT and inheritance tax dead certs to go up). There needs to be a rebalancing between wealthy older generations who benefited from free higher education, final salary pensions and astronomical house price growth and younger generations who have none of those opportunities. The issue is the means testing - Martin Lewis has been articulate on this. Drawing the line at those on pension credit is probably too low.

This.

bluenitsuj · Sep 14, 2024

Washie said:
Because they're told by employers, society, school, government, boomers that Uni is the only way to get a good job or else we'll end up at Macdonalds (pay higher than some roles that require a degree).

University is a choice.

Weststander · Sep 14, 2024

Tom Hark Preston Park said:
I'd like to see the government being more proactive in trying to trace those pensioners who qualify for Pension Credit but who don't claim it for whatever reason. The government seems to know the total number who qualify, but not the individuals. How does that work?

They would not know household incomes, for many reasons. There is no database.

The 880,000 would be an educated estimate.

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[Politics] Would YOU be happy to pay more income tax so OAPs could keep their fuel payments?

Would you be happy to pay an income tax increase and keep universal WFP?

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