- Jan 3, 2012
- 17,351
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[Politics] Brexit
- Thread starter KingstonSeagull
- Start date
Yes, I think one of the reasons why it seems so difficult to argue or debate with most Brexiters is that they are concerned with emotions and feelings, and what they want to believe, rather than evidence or facts.
This explains much of the appeal of Nigel Farage to Brexit supporters (and the appeal of Donald Trump to many of the angry white working-class in the US) - they ruthlessly appeal to visceral emotions, grievances, and often a sense of victimhood or imagined persecution, and present themselves as Saviours; new Messiahs.
That white working-class anger - totally justified in terms of poverty wages, insecure jobs, slum housing or rip-off rents, crumbling public services, and widening inequality - is then targeted, by Farage and Trump, at immigrants and the so-called liberal elite.
This serves it's real purpose - to prevent the white-working class from directing their anger at the corporate elites and multi-millionaires and billionaires who pay the poverty wages and charge exorbitant rents.
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aolstudios
Well-known member
Well put. It's a regularly stated argument of mine that emotions are wonderful things but applying them to politics & even human rights/protests etc might make one feel good & warm inside (or satisfyingly furious) but just lead us to take the first steps towards real fascism & atrocities. A little dramatic but demonstrably & depressingly often the case
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
Hopefully a first step towards re- integration back to being Europeans again and all the benefits that entails ! Bring it on Sir Kier.
nicko31
Well-known member
I thought Labour had ruled this out?
Even if they did, let's hope they've had a change of heart and make the first steps to put right the stupidity of Brexit.
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
They ruled out Freedom of Movement, but said they wanted to make Brexit work. This is more for students than anything else. Erasmus was ruled out by Johnson, even though the EU offered it as part of the Brexit deal. This doesn't go as far as Erasmus.
Hotchilidog
Well-known member
- Jan 24, 2009
- 9,120
They have apparently according to the Guardian. I thought this would have been a nice step back toward sanity for the rest of us in a few years, but it appears not. The nose will continue to remain cut off to spite our face
nicko31
Well-known member
Having a bilateral deal on 18-30 year olds would be great for our betrayed young people and help fill some Labour gaps. We’ll see …
Weststander
Well-known member
R5 Nicky Campbell ... for this next hour is all about our future relationship with the EU.
worthingweird
Well-known member
- Mar 8, 2023
- 358
Democracy...
nicko31
Well-known member
Good we're having grown up conversations for the first time in a long time. The relationship can only improve with mutual benefit, however changes will be limited with Starmer stupidly backing himself into a corner on many issues not least Customs Union membership.
So many stupid obstacles, like having a UK version of Reach. Costly regulation with no tangible benefit, almost as stupid as the UKCA compliance. We need to get back to regulatory alignment
Weststander
Well-known member
To keep my sanity, I think/hope Starmer's being a sly fox on this. Increasing integration is the agenda.
- Jul 10, 2003
- 27,760
Bravo at getting Nicky Campbell and grown up conversation into the same post
Are you feeling more positive about your leadership election this time round or do you want NSC's advice again
Are you feeling more positive about your leadership election this time round or do you want NSC's advice again
It is still deckchair shuffling... nothing significant will happen for at least 3 years.
nicko31
Well-known member
Metamorphosis into an EU re-join party is probably their best route back to power for a 2033 election
Reset with Europe does not mean reversing Brexit - Starmer
Starmer says he has been "absolutely clear" that he wants a reset in relations between the UK and EU and that the bilateral treaty meeting today is moving at pace.
Starmer clarifies that the reset with the EU "would not mean reversing Brexit or re-entering the single market or Customs Union".
He adds that there are no plans for a youth mobility scheme but there are plans for "a closer relationship".
nicko31
Well-known member
Very poor on the lack of a youth mobility scheme, a betrayal of young people but I'm not surprised. So can't have a summer job in Majorca, but can work in Melbourne..