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A Newbie posts his thoughts



Acker79

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Nov 15, 2008
31,921
Brighton
Hi everyone. I hear about this place each week on the SCR post match phone in, I hope it's not as negative as it sounds.

I wanted to share my thoughts on numerous topics that appear on SCR a lot, I apologise in advance if this meanders...

Attendance
This seems to be a favourite topic on the phone in. Almost every week we get complaints about the low attendance level. But every week I see in the News of the World the average attendance table and our attendance is right in the middle. Last time I looked we were 12th in the attendance table, that's higher than our league position!

To get such an attendance when the tickets are the price they are, when the stands are temporary structures that shake when the fans jump around, when we park our cars three miles away and catch a bus, when the team has such disappointing, at best inconsistent home form, to get average attendance for our division is a fantastic achievement.


Prices
The only way we will get better attendance is if the team consistently dominate at home, or at least consistently win so that we are up in the top spots, or if ticket prices fall. I hear quite often from Dick Knight et al that they can't lower the prices because they have to be set at the start of the season. Why have they constantly set the prices so high at the start of the past several seasons? They knew last season people were complaining about the price. I suppose next season they'll say they can't lower it because some people bought two year season tickets this year and it's unfair on them...

Manager
We've had so many managers in the last 10 years I don't really connect to them, and often feel it's only a matter of time before they leave, even if they're doing well.

Having said that I was disappointed with Wilkins being replaced, he created two promotion chasing teams last season after a chritsmas mess up caused by the board and a couple of players during contract negotiations.

How many managers could put together two promotion chasing teams in one season? And Knight says he isn't the guy for us going forward? Bull. In my opinion Knight, like a lot of people, are blinded by this belief we should be selling out every week, decided to try the easy route, believing Adams would bring in the crowd.

Mickey Adams's first stint with Brighton came after some pretty crappy seasons, so when he didn't take us to the top within hisfirst three games no one was surprised.

This time around we've had promotions, near promotions, and two of those promotions were largely due to Mickey Adams. We have high expectations, but we also expect them immediately. He didn't take over a struggling team, he took over a team that was already settled and ready to push on, and we can't understand why he's unsettled them.

Jake Robinson
He had a lot of potential, he was one for the future. He claims he is a forward, he was given a run up front by Mark McGee and he didn't live up to that potential. He put in some good performances on the wing, and has been used there on and off.

Neither Dean Wilkins or Mickey Adams have given him a run. When Dean went Jake complained about being ignored, doing everything he can and not being given a chance.

This year I've read more interviews in the argus from him than any other player, talking about how he scored against scunthorpe as if that's enough to earn his place in the team. He got one consolation goal late in a game against opponents who were 4-0 up and had the game pretty much wrapped up.

I think perhaps Jake should look at his all round game and try to improve that, as Dean Cox has done, and maybe it'll show next time he gets an opportunity, or perhaps he should look to play elsewhere.

It's sad, but I don't think he lived up to his early potential.

Dick Knight and the Board
If not for Dick Knight we might not have a club. That is undeniable.

But we didn't always hate Bill Archer and David Bellotti, did we?

His saving of the club can only carry him so far, and for me he has lots of things starting go against him:

1) Every so often we hear about potential investors put off because he won't give them any control. Only the most ardent fan will heavily invest in a club and not want to have a say. But these are rumours and should be taken with a pinch of salt. I generally ignore it but when paired with the McGhee firing, I start to wonder...

2) The McGee firing. For the longest time Knight stod by McGhee. I disagreed with his decision (for me the play off final was a sign of McGhee's failing - he took over a club coasting to automatic promotion and needed luck in the play offs to go up), but I respected his loyalty, especially in today's football.

In the summer after we were relegated "The Board" had a meeting, and "The board" agreed, that "the board" would keep McGhee as manager. It was a decision announced by "the board" and that was it.

A few months later and the fans are not only calling for McGhee to go, they wanted Dick Knight to go too. Suddenly Dick Knigt comes out and Dick Knight appear on Sky sports news, and on BBC and in the apers andDick Knight announces that Dick Knight has made the decision that Dick Knight was going to fire McGhee because Dick Knight listens to the fans.

An unpopular decision is a board decision, a popular one is a Dick Knight decision? That's just wrong.

How long can he ride the 'saved the club' train? He didn't do it alone, many people were involved, including many fans. He didn't single-handedly save the club, and it doesn't give him carte blanche to do whatever he likes.

This Season
We have a team that is capable of winning promotion. Automatically.

The problem we have is consistency. Against Millwall, Leicester, and Man City we put on performances what this team is capable of, which makes it all the more frustrating when we put on the sort of performances we did against Walsall, and Carlisle for example.

This frustration and inconsistency leads to a lot of negativity. It makes our position in the table, and the season ahead seem like it is destined to be equally frustrating and disappointing.


Fans
I am a strong believer in the fans right to boo. Not because we some how earn the right by buying a ticket, but because it is our only avenue to express displeasure at performances and results.

There is an often cited example for the 'non-booers' about how we wuldn't boo a shop girl. But if a shop girl doesn't do her job, you can speak personally to her supervisor, manager, you can send a letter o complaint to the store, to customer service, to head office, if they don't solve your complaint there are ombudsmen you can complain to.

But chances are the store will sole your problem, they have to because thy are competing against other stores for your money. Football clubs aren't. They're not competing to keep you, you've already chosen them, and they're your club until you die.

If we write a letter of complaint to the club about how we are unsatisfied with the performance of one of their employees, say for example, Matt Richards. Will the club give us a refund? Will they give us a gift voucher to entice us back to the ground? They would not. That option isn't available to us, booing is our only option.

Yes, some players go into their shells and lose confidence, but others will take it as a challenge, they will step up and try to prove what happened before was a bad day, that they're not worthy of being booed, their pride forces them to stick it to the crowd. Matt Richards did after the haranguing he received against Walsall, Guy Butters turned the crowd around and became an Albion legend.

MOST fans don't enjoy booing. They don't enjoy their team screwing up. They boo because they feel they have to to help the team, to stop the team repeating mistakes and falling further than they have to. If we highlight problems the club/team have attention will be paid to these issues and they will be corrected.

Fans moan about bad performances. It's natural. People celebrate good performances. That is also natural. It isn't fickle. It isn't a sign that the person should be dismissed and their opinions sneered at. It's how it should be. We don't have to moan at good performances for our moans at bad performances to be taken seriously. We don't expect people to cheer at bad performances, do we?


I'm sure there were other things I wanted to say, but I got caught up in these other comments and some others have left my mind.
 




Questions

Habitual User
Oct 18, 2006
25,332
Worthing
Concise and to the point.................. I like him.
 


Icy Gull

Back on the rollercoaster
Jul 5, 2003
72,015
Good first post :bowdown:

Welcome
 




clippedgull

Hotdogs, extra onions
Aug 11, 2003
20,789
Near Ducks, Geese, and Seagulls
Welcome to the board :wave:

Some good points there.

I particulary liked your summing up on the fans right to show displeasure.

Some boo, some stay quiet, and more worringly, a LOT don't bother turning up.

I'd rather have the boo boys than empty seats.
 






Hi everyone. I hear about this place each week on the SCR post match phone in, I hope it's not as negative as it sounds.

I wanted to share my thoughts on numerous topics that appear on SCR a lot, I apologise in advance if this meanders...

Attendance
This seems to be a favourite topic on the phone in. Almost every week we get complaints about the low attendance level. But every week I see in the News of the World the average attendance table and our attendance is right in the middle. Last time I looked we were 12th in the attendance table, that's higher than our league position!

To get such an attendance when the tickets are the price they are, when the stands are temporary structures that shake when the fans jump around, when we park our cars three miles away and catch a bus, when the team has such disappointing, at best inconsistent home form, to get average attendance for our division is a fantastic achievement.


Prices
The only way we will get better attendance is if the team consistently dominate at home, or at least consistently win so that we are up in the top spots, or if ticket prices fall. I hear quite often from Dick Knight et al that they can't lower the prices because they have to be set at the start of the season. Why have they constantly set the prices so high at the start of the past several seasons? They knew last season people were complaining about the price. I suppose next season they'll say they can't lower it because some people bought two year season tickets this year and it's unfair on them...

Manager
We've had so many managers in the last 10 years I don't really connect to them, and often feel it's only a matter of time before they leave, even if they're doing well.

Having said that I was disappointed with Wilkins being replaced, he created two promotion chasing teams last season after a chritsmas mess up caused by the board and a couple of players during contract negotiations.

How many managers could put together two promotion chasing teams in one season? And Knight says he isn't the guy for us going forward? Bull. In my opinion Knight, like a lot of people, are blinded by this belief we should be selling out every week, decided to try the easy route, believing Adams would bring in the crowd.

Mickey Adams's first stint with Brighton came after some pretty crappy seasons, so when he didn't take us to the top within hisfirst three games no one was surprised.

This time around we've had promotions, near promotions, and two of those promotions were largely due to Mickey Adams. We have high expectations, but we also expect them immediately. He didn't take over a struggling team, he took over a team that was already settled and ready to push on, and we can't understand why he's unsettled them.

Jake Robinson
He had a lot of potential, he was one for the future. He claims he is a forward, he was given a run up front by Mark McGee and he didn't live up to that potential. He put in some good performances on the wing, and has been used there on and off.

Neither Dean Wilkins or Mickey Adams have given him a run. When Dean went Jake complained about being ignored, doing everything he can and not being given a chance.

This year I've read more interviews in the argus from him than any other player, talking about how he scored against scunthorpe as if that's enough to earn his place in the team. He got one consolation goal late in a game against opponents who were 4-0 up and had the game pretty much wrapped up.

I think perhaps Jake should look at his all round game and try to improve that, as Dean Cox has done, and maybe it'll show next time he gets an opportunity, or perhaps he should look to play elsewhere.

It's sad, but I don't think he lived up to his early potential.

Dick Knight and the Board
If not for Dick Knight we might not have a club. That is undeniable.

But we didn't always hate Bill Archer and David Bellotti, did we?

His saving of the club can only carry him so far, and for me he has lots of things starting go against him:

1) Every so often we hear about potential investors put off because he won't give them any control. Only the most ardent fan will heavily invest in a club and not want to have a say. But these are rumours and should be taken with a pinch of salt. I generally ignore it but when paired with the McGhee firing, I start to wonder...

2) The McGee firing. For the longest time Knight stod by McGhee. I disagreed with his decision (for me the play off final was a sign of McGhee's failing - he took over a club coasting to automatic promotion and needed luck in the play offs to go up), but I respected his loyalty, especially in today's football.

In the summer after we were relegated "The Board" had a meeting, and "The board" agreed, that "the board" would keep McGhee as manager. It was a decision announced by "the board" and that was it.

A few months later and the fans are not only calling for McGhee to go, they wanted Dick Knight to go too. Suddenly Dick Knigt comes out and Dick Knight appear on Sky sports news, and on BBC and in the apers andDick Knight announces that Dick Knight has made the decision that Dick Knight was going to fire McGhee because Dick Knight listens to the fans.

An unpopular decision is a board decision, a popular one is a Dick Knight decision? That's just wrong.

How long can he ride the 'saved the club' train? He didn't do it alone, many people were involved, including many fans. He didn't single-handedly save the club, and it doesn't give him carte blanche to do whatever he likes.

This Season
We have a team that is capable of winning promotion. Automatically.

The problem we have is consistency. Against Millwall, Leicester, and Man City we put on performances what this team is capable of, which makes it all the more frustrating when we put on the sort of performances we did against Walsall, and Carlisle for example.

This frustration and inconsistency leads to a lot of negativity. It makes our position in the table, and the season ahead seem like it is destined to be equally frustrating and disappointing.


Fans
I am a strong believer in the fans right to boo. Not because we some how earn the right by buying a ticket, but because it is our only avenue to express displeasure at performances and results.

There is an often cited example for the 'non-booers' about how we wuldn't boo a shop girl. But if a shop girl doesn't do her job, you can speak personally to her supervisor, manager, you can send a letter o complaint to the store, to customer service, to head office, if they don't solve your complaint there are ombudsmen you can complain to.

But chances are the store will sole your problem, they have to because thy are competing against other stores for your money. Football clubs aren't. They're not competing to keep you, you've already chosen them, and they're your club until you die.

If we write a letter of complaint to the club about how we are unsatisfied with the performance of one of their employees, say for example, Matt Richards. Will the club give us a refund? Will they give us a gift voucher to entice us back to the ground? They would not. That option isn't available to us, booing is our only option.

Yes, some players go into their shells and lose confidence, but others will take it as a challenge, they will step up and try to prove what happened before was a bad day, that they're not worthy of being booed, their pride forces them to stick it to the crowd. Matt Richards did after the haranguing he received against Walsall, Guy Butters turned the crowd around and became an Albion legend.

MOST fans don't enjoy booing. They don't enjoy their team screwing up. They boo because they feel they have to to help the team, to stop the team repeating mistakes and falling further than they have to. If we highlight problems the club/team have attention will be paid to these issues and they will be corrected.

Fans moan about bad performances. It's natural. People celebrate good performances. That is also natural. It isn't fickle. It isn't a sign that the person should be dismissed and their opinions sneered at. It's how it should be. We don't have to moan at good performances for our moans at bad performances to be taken seriously. We don't expect people to cheer at bad performances, do we?


I'm sure there were other things I wanted to say, but I got caught up in these other comments and some others have left my mind.

Shut it!

oh...wait, I meant "welcome to the board and I hope you add loads more to the debates on here"

Oh, and don't forget to back the stewards in everything they do in maintaining safety and order - or we'll truncheon you to a soggy pulp behind the stands. :lolol:
 


Questions

Habitual User
Oct 18, 2006
25,332
Worthing
Do you think that is the longest ever first post on here ?

I will take it in when I get the time as well because I`ve heard its a bloody good read.
 












Gilliver's Travels

Peripatetic
Jul 5, 2003
2,921
Brighton Marina Village
Yes, but what you don't say is whether you are basing all this comment on personal experience... or archair analysis.

And how come you've only just discovered NSC? Are you actually an Albion fan, or, more plausibly, a visiting Martian who once tuned into SCR by mistake?

Or, given your comments on DK, are you, in fact, bhadeb's smarter brother?
 




Yes, but what you don't say is whether you are basing all this comment on personal experience... or archair analysis.

And how come you've only just discovered NSC? Are you actually an Albion fan, or, more plausibly, a visiting Martian who once tuned into SCR by mistake?

Or, given your comments on DK, are you, in fact, bhadeb's smarter brother?

Well maybe he's only just discovered computers or only just got an internet connection - you seem to be criticising him for not joning NSC earlier without knowing his age!
 




SittingbourneSeagull

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2007
1,101
Sittingbourne
Nice first post, welcome to the board.

You have set a standard that is gonna be hard for you to maintain.
 


Garage_Doors

Originally the Swankers
Jun 28, 2008
11,790
Brighton
Welcome t the NSC, want some good advice ? run , run as fast as you can and never look back !!!

Otherwise this place will suck you in and you will never be able t leave !:lolol:
 




Northstander

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2003
14,031
Im thinking they are still on their way home.... 8 Pages :laugh:

Welcome to NSC
*Dons Tin Hat and awaits arrival of Brighton and Hove Coaches*
 




clapham_gull

Legacy Fan
Aug 20, 2003
25,741
Some very good points in there.

I agree on the pricing, it's pitched too high, all it leads to is low crowds.
 


Acker79

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Nov 15, 2008
31,921
Brighton
Yes, but what you don't say is whether you are basing all this comment on personal experience... or archair analysis.

And how come you've only just discovered NSC? Are you actually an Albion fan, or, more plausibly, a visiting Martian who once tuned into SCR by mistake?

Or, given your comments on DK, are you, in fact, bhadeb's smarter brother?

I'm 28, been a fan since I was 6 (I was a match mascot for theleague cup match against brentford in 89 - we lost 3-0, I had my picture taken with Dean Wilkins). I used to have a season ticket at the goldstone, managed at least one game a season at Gillingham, had a season ticket at withdean three seasons ago (the one in which we got relegated). I went to 10, I think, home games last season, have not been to any yet this year but do intend to. I listen to the matches on SCR and read the report in the argus, in national papers, hear opinions from fans.

I haven't only just discovered NSC, I've only just signed up. (I got a new laptop this week). I've heard talk of it on SCR for the past couple of seasons, and this place doesn't come across too well on there, and the odd occasions I've visited here before it's been very intimidating. This time I decided to take the plunge.
 


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