[News] Exploding pagers across Lebanon

Psychobilly freakout said:

Forgive me if I have this wrong.
1: As I understand it Israel and Lebanon have been at odds for decades.
2: There have been long standing border issues with Israeli settlers ousting locals, more than 200,000 displaced.
3: They are obviously a terrorist group involved and have been firing rockets in support of the Palestinian brothers as they see them ever since the start of the this whole thing.
4: I think (something I should not do) they are firing rockets in support and as a measure for them to say, Israel we will not let you take anymore of our land, and you will not do to us what Israel have done to the Palestinians by murdering and displacing thousands.

For every action there is a reaction.

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aolstudios said:

You tell me. It's a war. What would've been acceptable in ww2? (Crucially, including combatants - even Hamas have had to admit they're included).

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aolstudios said:

My point was that he was obsessively quoting a figure that was absolute bullshit.

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aolstudios said:

Also, let's not forget. Without October 7th, that figure would read 0.

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aolstudios said:

(although the figures include a big bunch that would've died of natural causes anyway)

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Psychobilly freakout said:

For every action there is a reaction.

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hans kraay fan club said:

Civilians killed in indiscriminate bombings? None.


Regardless of him repeating the specific figure - the figure itself is scarcely relevant to the point he's is making. As you know.

As if. It would have been much, much lower, but it hasn't been '0' at any point, in many, many years.


Oh I see - you are just taking the piss. More fool me for engaging.

Have a nice day.

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aolstudios said:

You keep obsessively quoting that figure. Which comes directly from Hamas. & even they recently had to admit their figures were wildly exaggerated. Still if it makes you feel good, you do you

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Psychobilly freakout said:

and you continually put a laughing emoji when i do, glad you find it funny even if it half that amount.

Done talking to you too, you seem to have the same agender.

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Psychobilly freakout said:

and you continually put a laughing emoji when i do, glad you find it funny even if it is half that amount which I doubt.

Done talking to you too, you seem to have the same agender.

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‘UN rights chief demands accountability for Lebanon pager blasts​

Further explosions take place in multiple cities in Lebanon – Middle East crisis live | Israel-Gaza war | The Guardian

A source in Hezbollah confirmed that walkie-talkies used by the group were being targeted

amp.theguardian.com

Wardy's twin said:

Israel doesn't have a problem with Lebanon , Israel has an issue with the Palestinians who moved there after the creation of the Israeli state and from whom were drafted PLO fighters to attack Israel. The majority of the original Lebanese people (Christian arabs & Druze) do not want the Palestinians there and fought against them with the help of the Israelis . Hezbollah moved in and are too powerful for the Lebanese to control so they basically use the southern part of Lebanon to attack Israel.

By settlers do you mean those Jews that settled in Israel in the late 1940s? Do you believe the state of Israel shouldn't exist ?

Hezbollah is driven by Iran and its agenda not what the Palestinians want.

Israel is not after taking land from Lebanon , it would prefer that there was a stable, neutral government there as there was for the first 30 years of its existence i.e. during the 1947, 56, 67 and 73 wars Israel did not have to worry about large attacks from the North.

In all the comments nothing is ever said about the destabilisation of Lebanon by the first the PLO and then Hezbollah which has resulted in killings.

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beorhthelm said:

while following some rules of war accepted at the time, we did a lot of things we dont find acceptable today. maybe at least try to address the question without resorting to whataboutery.

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Shropshire Seagull said:

In physics, yes.

But in the humanitarian world this is called "an eye for an eye".
If this were applied, the whole world would be blind ....

The human approach is E+R=O
When an EVENT occurs a RESPONSE can be chosen (including nil) - the RESPONSE chosen will dictate the OUTCOME
Simple in micro events but macro events like terrorism it's easier said then done.

I have no answers.
What I do observe is that it appears (to me) that 99% of global conflict is either religion or political based.
If we could just irradiate the root-cause, maybe that would fix the problem(s)?

A sad and dangerous world we live in ....

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junior said:

Walkie-talkies exploding there now according to BBC News

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Wardy's twin said:

It was never the objective of the IRA to wipe out the protestants or the English and there in lies the major difference and that is pretty much true of the groups you mention above. In the case of the IRA it was clear that the conflict was going nowhere, support was waning (especially as economic conditions improved) and rational people (yes i did say that) decided that peace might be a better option .

Until its clear that demands for the destruction of Israel are stopped then the Netanyahu's position seems justified to the current majority of Israelis and with that comes the continued aggressiveness.

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Harry Wilson's tackle said:

Sorry, not following your point. I was saying that it doesn't matter whether we think that the collateral deaths associated with the pager bombs means that this act is not as bad as 9/11 or is just as bad (in a game of terror top trumps). I think it means 'not as bad' but I don't think that what I think will affect anything going forward, for the reasons explained.

And related to that, I don't think that the pager bombs has made it any more or less likely that Hamas or Hezbollah will make peace with Israel (that was not my point by the way, my point was about whether what we think about it will have any influence on whether Hamas or Hezbollah will make peace with Israel (and indeed, vice versa)).

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Psychobilly freakout said:

I do think it is a cop out.

You do not care either, that is your opinion and your certainly allowed to hold it, but it speaks volumes to me.

I am done holding a conversation with you, because I can be persuaded with valid points and arguments.
You clearly have an allegiance to a death machine that kills just as indiscriminately as Hezbollah and Hamas.

Good luck with your life.

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Seagull58 said:

The IRA'S objective was to remove Northern Ireland from the UK and incorporate it back into the Irish State. They decided to turn away from violence and embrace a peaceful politic process, as a result of which Sin Fein participates in the governance of Northern Ireland.
It is not totally inconceivable that a peaceful political way forward would be embraced in the Middle East, such as a 2 State solution, and Hezbollah, Hamas etc. lay down their arms.

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Seagull58 said:

You said "Perhaps the worst aspect of this, collateral damage aside, is that it will achieve nothing useful. The terrorists are hardly going to think "boy, those Israelis are damned smart - we had better leave them alone and seek a peace deal".
My point is that you can't be sure of that. There are many instances of terrorist/freedom fighter organisations giving up armed struggle for various reasons.

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