[News] Exploding pagers across Lebanon

Pavilionaire · 2024-09-18T14:04:04+0100

It is incredible that it seems beyond the capabilities of mankind to agree a peaceful co-existence between two groups of people living in an area smaller than the size of Belgium.

I have been to Israel twice, - in the 90s - but the place is too dangerous now. Even then, on the day I arrived a bus had blown up on the Jaffa Road near the bus station that morning killing 26 and injuring 48.

It was very eerie given we had to walk past that very spot spot to reach our hotel. Who knows what might have happened had we arrived in the city a few hours earlier?

The nub of the issue is that Jews consider the land of Israel - including Gaza and the West Bank - to be given to them by God, and therefore, giving land away to the Arabs is an affront to God.

The enshrinement of rights in something deemed sacred is a tough one to overcome, and if the Yanks can't sort the right to bear arms that still plagues their country then they sure as hell won't sort the Arab / Israeli conflict.

Seagull58 · 2024-09-18T14:04:28+0100

Psychobilly freakout said:
Amazing, why are two children dead then ?

Presumably because they were in the immediate vicinity of the Hezbollah operatives who were in possession of the pagers.

SeagullinExile · 2024-09-18T14:04:54+0100

Seagull58 said:
It was a precisely targeted attack on the Hezbolla organisational structure, designed to disrupt and immobilise it.

Which killed children. Defend it as much as you want. It’s terrorism, nothing less.

Psychobilly freakout · 2024-09-18T14:07:24+0100

Seagull58 said:
Presumably because they were in the immediate vicinity of the Hezbollah operatives who were in possession of the pagers.

that is ok then, phew.....

Shaktarman · 2024-09-18T14:08:08+0100

Why do people these days feel the need to ‘defend’ sick acts? There should be no sides taken by anyone in the UK other than to feel sick at all the acts of murder happening from all sides in all wars. It should never be a place for point scoring over who did what when - everyone is wrong in my opinion. End of.

Seagull58 · 2024-09-18T14:08:19+0100

GingerBeerMan said:
The one bit of solace I get from this thread is that apart from the two nutters who apparently are fine with a bit of light genocide, the overwhelming opinion of sensible Brits seems to be disgust at the Israeli regime for the thousands of deaths they are causing.

12 deaths, not thousands.

Psychobilly freakout · 2024-09-18T14:10:03+0100

Seagull58 said:
Presumably because they were in the immediate vicinity of the Hezbollah operatives who were in possession of the pagers.

Actually when you say Hezbollah operative, you do realise that some folks will be coerced into doing things like lookouts, storage etc because of where they live or job and not necessarily be a member or supporter of Hezbollah don't you !

Psychobilly freakout · 2024-09-18T14:10:53+0100

Seagull58 said:
12 deaths, not thousands.

your ignore the 43000 dead in Palestine then....
that has nothing to do with this in your eyes.

aolstudios · 2024-09-18T14:13:58+0100

beorhthelm said:
while following some rules of war accepted at the time, we did a lot of things we dont find acceptable today. maybe at least try to address the question without resorting to whataboutery.

That's not whataboutery.
I'm highlighting that there doesn't seem to be any means that Jews are allowed to defend themselves against a foe whose stated aim is to kill them all.
This is defence against a war of annihilation. On several fronts. Maiming your enemy's combatants is kind of normal in war.
But unacceptable for Jews, evidently

Seagull58 · 2024-09-18T14:14:07+0100

Psychobilly freakout said:
that is ok then, phew.....

At no point have I commented on whether it's ok or not. Are collateral civilian deaths ever OK in a military operation? I'm sure that can be debated for ever with many examples from history. The point I'm making is that Mossad did not target civilians and did not make an untargetted attack. They went after Hezbollah operational targets.

Seagull58 · 2024-09-18T14:14:47+0100

Psychobilly freakout said:
your ignore the 43000 dead in Palestine then....
that has nothing to do with this in your eyes.

This thread is about the pager attack.

Seagull58 · 2024-09-18T14:17:27+0100

Shaktarman said:
Why do people these days feel the need to ‘defend’ sick acts? There should be no sides taken by anyone in the UK other than to feel sick at all the acts of murder happening from all sides in all wars. It should never be a place for point scoring over who did what when - everyone is wrong in my opinion. End of.

Without wishing to divert the thread but in direct response to your post, so what is your view of the Russia-Ukraine conflict?

aolstudios · 2024-09-18T14:17:59+0100

pocketseagull said:
My error, the amount of civilian injuries is unknown, although we do know for certain two children were killed.

Do you think it an acceptable tactic to be used against the IDF in Tel Aviv?

We don't 'know for certain'.
Only that Hezbollah have said so (as Hamas often 'say so' before it turns out to be made up).
Every news channel is saying "according to Hezbollah" or "according to Lebanon" (which is the same thing)

aolstudios · 2024-09-18T14:18:38+0100

Seagull58 said:
Without wishing to divert the thread but in direct response to your post, so what is your view of the Russia-Ukraine conflict?

No Jews, no news

Psychobilly freakout · 2024-09-18T14:19:02+0100

Seagull58 said:
This thread is about the pager attack.

The two are related, the whole thing is related if you can't see that, I am sorry.

The whole thing between Israel, Palestine, Lebanon and Iran is one and the same.

beorhthelm · 2024-09-18T14:21:35+0100

aolstudios said:
That's not whataboutery.
I'm highlighting that there doesn't seem to be any means that Jews are allowed to defend themselves against a foe whose stated aim is to kill them all.
This is defence against a war of annihilation. On several fronts. Maiming your enemy's combatants is kind of normal in war.
But unacceptable for Jews, evidently

oh please. Hezbollah is in no position to conduct a war of annihilation. they are terrorists who greatly impact on the peaceful living of those in northen Israel. taking out their leaders in assassinations is fair game. shooting soliders on the battlefield, standard warfare. deliberatly injuring soliders, posing no immediate threat, in public spaces is just nasty.

schmunk · 2024-09-18T14:25:25+0100

aolstudios said:
What on earth do you think we did to the Germans in ww2? Sang them lullabies?

The celebrated Dambusters raids (Operation Chastise) killed an estimated 1,600 civilians, mostly Allied prisoners of war.

Psychobilly freakout · 2024-09-18T14:26:08+0100

aolstudios said:
That's not whataboutery.
I'm highlighting that there doesn't seem to be any means that Jews are allowed to defend themselves against a foe whose stated aim is to kill them all.
This is defence against a war of annihilation. On several fronts. Maiming your enemy's combatants is kind of normal in war.
But unacceptable for Jews, evidently

But what is acceptable for jews evidently is indiscriminately bomb civilians, hospitals and schools killing 43000. 43000 let that sink in....

Is that an appropriate response ?

Seagull58 · 2024-09-18T14:28:51+0100

Psychobilly freakout said:
you have not answered my previous question, do you think 430000 dead, thousands maimed and displaced is an acceptable response to the original atrocity by Hamas ?

It's a very complex, awful situation that has been going on for close to 80 years with 2 full-blown wars and continual border incidents. Impossible, imo, to say with any degree of conviction whether the Israeli response is acceptable or not without knowing how the conflict will evolve. If you think that's a cop out then so be it.

London Irish · 2024-09-18T14:31:06+0100

Shaktarman said:
Why do people these days feel the need to ‘defend’ sick acts? There should be no sides taken by anyone in the UK other than to feel sick at all the acts of murder happening from all sides in all wars. It should never be a place for point scoring over who did what when - everyone is wrong in my opinion. End of.

Because we have too many sociopaths in our midsts. Pretty easy to spot who would have been the concentration camp guards if they were born in the time and place

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[News] Exploding pagers across Lebanon

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