[Politics] The Labour Government

Bodian · Jul 25, 2024

Machiavelli said:
Do you make these accusations to everybody that has a job? Do you have a job?

The difference is though that she stood on this ticket, and knew what was in the manifesto.

If I were applying for a job with an organisation, and I strongly disagreed with one of their main statements / policies - then I would seriously be considering whether I should actually be applying for that job.

But if I were already in a job, and the organisation changed one of it's policies to something I didn't like - it would be a harder decision to actually resign - because of course I would want to keep the salary/pension. But by not resigning, I would effectively having to accept the policy. Yes - I could try and change it back again from within the organisation - but if I went public and stated that I wholly disagreed with it, then I would be out on my ear and facing gross misconduct charges.

Machiavelli · Jul 25, 2024

Bodian said:
The difference is though that she stood on this ticket, and knew what was in the manifesto.

If I were applying for a job with an organisation, and I strongly disagreed with one of their main statements / policies - then I would seriously be considering whether I should actually be applying for that job.

But if I were already in a job, and the organisation changed one of it's policies to something I didn't like - it would be a harder decision to actually resign - because of course I would want to keep the salary/pension. But by not resigning, I would effectively having to accept the policy. Yes - I could try and change it back again from within the organisation - but if I went public and stated that I wholly disagreed with it, then I would be out on my ear and facing gross misconduct charges.

She (and it's interesting that only one individual is being singled out) was actually re-applying for a job and it's not a normal job. Irrespective of what we think of those voting against (or, as in the case of Rosie Duffield, who couldn't vote against but wanted to) or Starmer's response -- neither of which I have any strong feeling about -- it was specifically about the claim that MPs are in it for the job/salary/pension which I'd dispute strongly.

abc · Jul 25, 2024

Zeberdi said:
Thanks

That is a strong argument for scrapping the cap not reinstating it (it is already in place) - I don’t know how you deal with ‘feckless’ irresponsibility but taxpayers end up footing an enormous bill for the irresponsibility of adults daily who commit crimes, who are addicted to alcohol or drugs, who have obese-related diseases or just fcuk up their kids mentally and physically so they simply fail to thrive as ‘grown ups‘. Education, better access to family planning, better access to housing? Better basic/universal minimum wage? Not sure there is a cure for irresponsibility but won’t be reckless over-spending of limited public funds and it shouldn’t be enabled by social care policies either.

Multi-birth already comes under one of the exceptions to the rule so one can presume in a fair sytem, it would if the cap for universal credit and child tax credits were for example to be scrapped temporarily but reinstated for all 3+ children born after 2025.

Two Child Limit Exception

Turn2us jargon buster definition of Two Child Limit Exception

www.turn2us.org.uk

Apologies, I meant scrapping! I was trying to say reinstating the right to child benefit for all children in a family but got my words in a muddle

nicko31 · Jul 25, 2024

A big step in the right direction towards reducing our reliance in single use imported fossil fuels.

Great British Energy is becoming a reality – bringing with it cheap, clean and secure energy | Ed Miliband

We’re making the case for 21st-century, modern public ownership that serves our communities, says energy secretary Ed Miliband

www.theguardian.com

KZNSeagull · Jul 25, 2024

nicko31 said:
A big step in the right direction towards reducing our reliance in single use imported fossil fuels.

Great British Energy is becoming a reality – bringing with it cheap, clean and secure energy | Ed Miliband

We’re making the case for 21st-century, modern public ownership that serves our communities, says energy secretary Ed Miliband

www.theguardian.com

It is a good start but I don't see why it will be cheaper for consumers as I thought all electricity, no matter how produced, was sold on the same market?

beorhthelm · Jul 25, 2024

KZNSeagull said:
It is a good start but I don't see why it will be cheaper for consumers as I thought all electricity, no matter how produced, was sold on the same market?

heard nothing about changes to how energy markets and contracts are structured. where once it was engineered to make renewables viable against cheaper gas, now the distortions work against. so next time the gas gets cut, energy prices spike, we'd have exactly the same happen as last time.

Bob! · Jul 25, 2024

KZNSeagull said:
It is a good start but I don't see why it will be cheaper for consumers as I thought all electricity, no matter how produced, was sold on the same market?

No, the model under a Conservative Government was to maximise profits.

This is the Labour Government model, produce Green energy without overcharging Customers

KZNSeagull said:
It is a good start but I don't see why it will be cheaper for consumers as I thought all electricity, no matter how produced, was sold on the same market?

We now have a Labour Government, the model is no longer to maximise profits for mates.

Jewish leaders accuse Government of ‘moral error’ over Netanyahu arrest warrant

The UK has dropped its opposition to the ICC pursuing an arrest warrant for the Israeli PM

liveapp.inews.co.uk

'He also said GB Energy will “drive down bills” and stood by the Labour pledge that they would be cut by £300 a year.'

Nicks · Jul 25, 2024

Bob! said:
No, the model under a Conservative Government was to maximise profits.

This is the Labour Government model, produce Green energy without overcharging Customers

We now have a Labour Government, the model is no longer to maximise profits for mates.

Jewish leaders accuse Government of ‘moral error’ over Netanyahu arrest warrant

The UK has dropped its opposition to the ICC pursuing an arrest warrant for the Israeli PM

liveapp.inews.co.uk

'He also said GB Energy will “drive down bills” and stood by the Labour pledge that they would be cut by £300 a year.'

If you listen to Milliband he says it will take at least 6 years to get Energy Bills down.

carlzeiss · Jul 25, 2024

nicko31 said:
A big step in the right direction towards reducing our reliance in single use imported fossil fuels.

Great British Energy is becoming a reality – bringing with it cheap, clean and secure energy | Ed Miliband

We’re making the case for 21st-century, modern public ownership that serves our communities, says energy secretary Ed Miliband

www.theguardian.com

Good job birds aren't voters then

Machiavelli · Jul 25, 2024

Nicks said:
If you listen to Milliband he says it will take at least 6 years to get Energy Bills down.

You either have problems understanding or are being disingenuous. He actually says that they'll begin to come down as the home-grown energy is produced during the course of the parliament -- which lasts a maximum of five (and not six) years.

Right Brain Ronnie · Jul 25, 2024

carlzeiss said:
Good job birds aren't voters then

Its totally the wrong answer to have all these turbines, I'm wondering how labour voters will like it when they spoil beautiful Britain and it's birds.

fly high · Jul 25, 2024

Machiavelli said:
You either have problems understanding or are being disingenuous. He actually says that they'll begin to come down as the home-grown energy is produced during the course of the parliament -- which lasts a maximum of five (and not six) years.

No bids for offshore wind in government auction

There will be no new offshore wind projects after firms said the price for electricity was too low.

www.bbc.co.uk

Who knows how long before household bills go down & how much they will have to go up to fund a massive increase in off shore wind. Yes eventually but how much pain before will have to be endured. I know many just hate Tories full stop, what ever they did but I assume Ed Miliband would have been happy to land households with higher bills by giving the bidders higher guaranteed price per kW than was on offer in 2023. Billions is needed from private investment for the offshore work plus hundreds of miles of new pylons & cables. £8.3 billion won't buy you much. Private investment means profit for private companies so policy is pretty much the same.

Harry Wilson's tackle · Jul 25, 2024

Mellor 3 Ward 4 said:
It was in the Labour Party manifesto.

If RLB didn't like it, or agree with it (or with KS's and the LP's stance on Gaza) it was quite possible for her to stand as an Independent at the GE.

She didn't (probably because in her constituency Labour would always win and she didn't want to lose her job/salary/pension) so she stands for Labour and then in the first vote, votes against her Party.

KS did the right thing IMO.

This.

A1X · Jul 25, 2024

Right Brain Ronnie said:
Its totally the wrong answer to have all these turbines, I'm wondering how labour voters will like it when they spoil beautiful Britain and it's birds.

nicko31 · Jul 25, 2024

Right Brain Ronnie said:
It’s totally the wrong answer to have all these turbines, I'm wondering how labour voters will like it when they spoil beautiful Britain and its birds.

Thank god there’s no threats to British birds from climate change and we just have to worry about the windmills

seagullsovergrimsby · Jul 25, 2024

Just tell the NIMBYS they have the choice of new housing developments , solar panel farms , wind turbines or electricity pylons.

nicko31 · Jul 25, 2024

Machiavelli said:
You either have problems understanding or are being disingenuous. He actually says that they'll begin to come down as the home-grown energy is produced during the course of the parliament -- which lasts a maximum of five (and not six) years.

On shore wind is the cheapest way to add new capacity to the grid. Lower energy costs will come. Price volatility will be reduced by this and greater storage capacity which will balance the grid. In my house I haven’t pulled from the grid at peak time in 2 years.

Machiavelli · Jul 25, 2024

fly high said:
No bids for offshore wind in government auction

There will be no new offshore wind projects after firms said the price for electricity was too low.

www.bbc.co.uk

Who knows how long before household bills go down & how much they will have to go up to fund a massive increase in off shore wind. Yes eventually but how much pain before will have to be endured. I know many just hate Tories full stop, what ever they did but I assume Ed Miliband would have been happy to land households with higher bills by giving the bidders higher guaranteed price per kW than was on offer in 2023. Billions is needed from private investment for the offshore work plus hundreds of miles of new pylons & cables. £8.3 billion won't buy you much. Private investment means profit for private companies so policy is pretty much the same.

There's a step-change here. The ambition is to crank up public investment through the parliament dependent on growth. There's also a coordinated plan. This will lead to reduced emissions, more home-grown energy produced, and this will be -- the clue is in the name -- renewable, rather than continuously using up fossil fuels. That continuous production will lead to longer-term reduction in bills.
But you're right in that the plan is for public and private investment, and that the former won't go too far. Given how efficient and effective renewable production has been so far and the expense and/or volatility of the alternatives, it looks like a pretty sound investment.
That summary is pretty accurate from my understanding which is far from perfect, but it's couched in a load of 'could', 'potentially', etc.

Taking everything in, it's clearly a good strategy overall.

nicko31 · Jul 25, 2024

Top guy, proper adults taking charge that understand industrial strategy

Nicks · Jul 25, 2024

Machiavelli said:
You either have problems understanding or are being disingenuous. He actually says that they'll begin to come down as the home-grown energy is produced during the course of the parliament -- which lasts a maximum of five (and not six) years.

He actually says "We will start to see the effect of it " and he also says 2030 which equals 6 years.
So he doesn't actually say when they will come down.

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