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[Misc] Electric Cars



H

Half Time Pies

Well-known member
Sep 7, 2003
1,498
Brighton
Greg Bobkin said:
I mean, I've driven numerous Teslas and spent two days covering about 400 miles as a driver and passenger in both versions of the EX30 – and shared the launch with a number of other journos who had similar conclusions to mine – but sure :thumbsup:

The point is that drivers shouldn't HAVE to 'get used to it'.
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Ultimately whether Volvo have dropped a clanger will be born out by sales and not by the opinion of Journalists! The model Y was Europes biggest selling car last year so the central touchscreen doesn't seem to be deterring people from buying Teslas.
 




G

Greg Bobkin

Silver Seagull
May 22, 2012
15,649
Half Time Pies said:
Ultimately whether Volvo have dropped a clanger will be born out by sales and not by the opinion of Journalists! The model Y was Europes biggest selling car last year so the central touchscreen doesn't seem to be deterring people from buying Teslas.
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Clearly, which is pretty much what I've already alluded to as the main reason Volvo has gone down that route :shrug:
 


G

Greg Bobkin

Silver Seagull
May 22, 2012
15,649
Half Time Pies said:
Theres absolutely no issues with having most of the controls through a central screen, Tesla have been doing this for years and I have owned 3 of them without any issues and theres certainly nothing dangerous about it. The HMI in the ID 3 got slated primarily because it was laggy and had lots of bugs and software issues, nothing to do with a lack of physical buttons and switches. Contrast this with the touchscreen in the Tesla which is intuitive and responsive and is constantly being improved and updated via over the air software updates. I did have a quick look at the EX30 the other day and the touchscreen looked pretty good to me and presumably similar to the one in the polestar which is owned by the same company.
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Sorry, but that is absolute bollocks. I can get you quotes directly from Volkswagen if you like that will prove that customer feedback about factors such as the shoddy haptic surfaces on the volume controls led to a re-think and, ultimately, a redesign. Tha'ts nothing to do with the software – it's clearly a hardware issue that was introduced to save money!
 


Paulie Gualtieri

Paulie Gualtieri

Bada Bing
NSC Patron
May 8, 2018
10,168
Our workplace has finally caught up and are offering a salary sacrifice scheme, so with my petrol lease ending in December I may well take the plunge.

Test drive the BMW I4 M50 as they didn’t have the e40 M sport version I may be after available as it sold in the morning.

The M50 was ridiculously rapid, to almost whiplash levels and was a nice play to sit as well. Real world range will be sufficient for my needs as well. Scheme comes with maintenance, insurance and free install of a home charger

Has one got any experience of the I4 on a long term basis as keen to get views?

Personally really liked it but fear there is some boy racer bias within my current view
 


albionalba

albionalba

Football with optimism
NSC Patron
Aug 31, 2023
201
sadly in Scotland
Paulie Gualtieri said:
Has one got any experience of the I4 on a long term basis as keen to get views?
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Only have i3 experience as a long time user 2015-2022. I really loved that car and it gave me great service for the first five years but felt that BMW really let me down badly when the battery control unit failed (cost of part alone is £5k, £8k to fit all in - and an uncertain diagnosis where it was to be all my risk). The long saga showed me that BMW don't intend any medium to long term ownership of their electric cars so if you plan to hang on to it go with your eyes open. They were utterly unhelpful and the lack of expertise across their dealer network meant that the dealer was constantly trying to get info etc out of the engineering base in Germany - and as you can imagine an eight year old car was of low interest. If you buy for long term suggest you depreciate the whole cost to say £5k residual mentally over five years. I got £4k for mine for scrap.
 




Audax

Audax

Boing boing boing...
Aug 3, 2015
3,205
Uckfield
Paulie Gualtieri said:
Our workplace has finally caught up and are offering a salary sacrifice scheme
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Snap! Same here, news came through end of last week but I missed it until today as I was on a day off on Friday. The lease on my Zoe is due to expire September next year (was Sept this year, but I extended it to the maximum 5 years), so it's well timed. Will need to do my research on lead times etc and what's available and expected cost. Would like to go with a vehicle-to-grid enabled car, but they are in the minority still.
 


Paulie Gualtieri

Paulie Gualtieri

Bada Bing
NSC Patron
May 8, 2018
10,168
albionalba said:
Only have i3 experience as a long time user 2015-2022. I really loved that car and it gave me great service for the first five years but felt that BMW really let me down badly when the battery control unit failed (cost of part alone is £5k, £8k to fit all in - and an uncertain diagnosis where it was to be all my risk). The long saga showed me that BMW don't intend any medium to long term ownership of their electric cars so if you plan to hang on to it go with your eyes open. They were utterly unhelpful and the lack of expertise across their dealer network meant that the dealer was constantly trying to get info etc out of the engineering base in Germany - and as you can imagine an eight year old car was of low interest. If you buy for long term suggest you depreciate the whole cost to say £5k residual mentally over five years. I got £4k for mine for scrap.
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That’s for the review

Will be very much in this for the short term (36months) and will need to assess the BIKT position as can see it goes up 1% every year until 2028.

Managed to source the I4 E40 M sport for £445 a month which is only £60 a month more than I am paying for a 2020 Tiguan (* inc maintenance plan and my private insurance) no upfront deposit either
 






Audax

Audax

Boing boing boing...
Aug 3, 2015
3,205
Uckfield
swindonseagull said:
All EV’s accelerate fast as they are either on or off and none need time to build the torque. At least that’s how it was explained to me.
My VW id4 is rapid from a stop so much so I had to attend a speed awareness course last year only had the thing a month !!
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Even my Zoe (with Eco mode off) gets going rapidly. Definitely not one where you want to plant the foot pulling out of a junction. Definitely need to get it pointed straight before that!
 


Hugo Rune

Hugo Rune

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Feb 23, 2012
23,362
Brighton
Commander said:
I've got an e-Golf (fully electric) and a hybrid Volvo. Getting an Audi E-tron (fully electric) once the Volvo lease is up next year. Can't really see why anyone who doesn't do regular 150 + mile journeys would want a petrol car.
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Did you get the Audi E-tron in the end? If so, what are your thoughts?

I’m looking to go electric later this year but I’m still unsure about how much cheaper it is. I only do a 100+ mile every couple of months so no issues with range anxiety.
 


Papak

Papak

Not an NSC licker...
Jul 11, 2003
2,205
Horsham
albionalba said:
I got £4k for mine for scrap.
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That is scary, I own a 2010 daily driver and a 1998 "Classic" with no expectation they are going to be scrapped anytime soon.

Presumably with an electrical issue was the scrap value for the remainder of the car to be parted out?

What was your TCO over the period you owned it?
 




Flounce

Flounce

Well-known member
Nov 15, 2006
3,456
Anyone going to go left field and plump for an Alpine A290? Could be the first genuine EV hot hatch
IMG_0144.jpeg
 


H

Half Time Pies

Well-known member
Sep 7, 2003
1,498
Brighton
albionalba said:
Only have i3 experience as a long time user 2015-2022. I really loved that car and it gave me great service for the first five years but felt that BMW really let me down badly when the battery control unit failed (cost of part alone is £5k, £8k to fit all in - and an uncertain diagnosis where it was to be all my risk). The long saga showed me that BMW don't intend any medium to long term ownership of their electric cars so if you plan to hang on to it go with your eyes open. They were utterly unhelpful and the lack of expertise across their dealer network meant that the dealer was constantly trying to get info etc out of the engineering base in Germany - and as you can imagine an eight year old car was of low interest. If you buy for long term suggest you depreciate the whole cost to say £5k residual mentally over five years. I got £4k for mine for scrap.
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Buying an i3 in 2015 you were an early adopter, this was BMW's first mass produced electric car and it was only a couple of years after it was launched. I had a 2015 Nissan Leaf and the technology has moved on massively since then as well as the servicing and support infrastructure for all of the major manufacturers. I am really surprised, based on the limitations of the technology at the time, that you had expectations that you could run it for 8 years without something significant going wrong and/ or the battery significantly degrading, and that BMW would still be producing the parts to repair it at a reasonable cost. My expectations were pretty low when I bought my Nissan leaf in 2015 which is why I part exchanged it after 3 years, Its range was barely 100 miles back then so I would be surprised if its still going now.
 








G

Greg Bobkin

Silver Seagull
May 22, 2012
15,649
Paulie Gualtieri said:
Our workplace has finally caught up and are offering a salary sacrifice scheme, so with my petrol lease ending in December I may well take the plunge.

Test drive the BMW I4 M50 as they didn’t have the e40 M sport version I may be after available as it sold in the morning.

The M50 was ridiculously rapid, to almost whiplash levels and was a nice play to sit as well. Real world range will be sufficient for my needs as well. Scheme comes with maintenance, insurance and free install of a home charger

Has one got any experience of the I4 on a long term basis as keen to get views?

Personally really liked it but fear there is some boy racer bias within my current view
Click to expand...
No long-term experience of an i4 (I had one for a week and it was great - as almost every BMW i model is), but I've been running an i5 40 for the past six months and it's largely brilliant. The infotainment system is pretty similar to the i4 (turn off gesture control and get used to some issues connecting to Android Auto, if you use it), only on a slightly smaller scale and it's a bit cramped if you're four or five-up.

Driving range-wise, what you see is pretty much what you get - unlike some models that will display, say 200 miles when fully charged, but actually only deliver 150. I also reached one mile off the WLTP figure (357 miles) after one charge, such I thought was pretty impressive.

I tend to favour BMW over the other premium German brands, mostly because they are really well put together, the performance is good and the interiors are high quality and a bit more interesting (Audi only gets the first bit right, IMO). The ride can be a bit firm at times, but it's certainly not unbearable (Mrs Bobkin loves the i5 and was a fan of the i4 - and she's quite critical (in a good way) off those sorts of things).

One thing I had heard about i4s that was putting people off was the costs involved, but it looks like you've got a really good deal there. Sal-sac is the way forward, but getting private drivers into EVs in big volumes is the real challenge...

Enjoy 👍🏼
 


Paulie Gualtieri

Paulie Gualtieri

Bada Bing
NSC Patron
May 8, 2018
10,168
Greg Bobkin said:
No long-term experience of an i4 (I had one for a week and it was great - as almost every BMW i model is), but I've been running an i5 40 for the past six months and it's largely brilliant. The infotainment system is pretty similar to the i4 (turn off gesture control and get used to some issues connecting to Android Auto, if you use it), only on a slightly smaller scale and it's a bit cramped if you're four or five-up.

Driving range-wise, what you see is pretty much what you get - unlike some models that will display, say 200 miles when fully charged, but actually only deliver 150. I also reached one mile off the WLTP figure (357 miles) after one charge, such I thought was pretty impressive.

I tend to favour BMW over the other premium German brands, mostly because they are really well put together, the performance is good and the interiors are high quality and a bit more interesting (Audi only gets the first bit right, IMO). The ride can be a bit firm at times, but it's certainly not unbearable (Mrs Bobkin loves the i5 and was a fan of the i4 - and she's quite critical (in a good way) off those sorts of things).

One thing I had heard about i4s that was putting people off was the costs involved, but it looks like you've got a really good deal there. Sal-sac is the way forward, but getting private drivers into EVs in big volumes is the real challenge...

Enjoy 👍🏼
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Thanks for taking the time 👍🏻

Didn’t even look at Audi as never been happy with interiors (first sign of getting older when the inside matters as much!) and I’ve never liked Mercedes, to me BMW is a class above both.

The i4 is due a facelift release this month so i suspect it will be a 2023 model but the standard kit hasn’t changed really.

The car was pre spec so no option to add any packs. I don’t think the tech pack is massively useful for me (compared to standard kit) I would have taken the comfort pack (fully electric front seats and wireless phone charger) but can live without it.

Glad to here on the range being real world realistic as the sales staff said the same and I say said well you would say that!
 


Bozza

Bozza

You can change this
Helpful Moderator
Jul 4, 2003
56,529
Back in Sussex
Hugo Rune said:
I’m looking to go electric later this year but I’m still unsure about how much cheaper it is. I only do a 100+ mile every couple of months so no issues with range anxiety.
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Sounds similar to me - long drives are very few and far between these days.

When my old Civic finally gives up the ghost, I do wonder if a hybrid would be the best option.

50-100 mile battery range would cover 95%+ of my driving, enabling me to charge for pennies at home as and when.

For longer drives, it seems that the chargers, certainly the quick ones, cost about the same as petrol so why not just use petrol and do away with the hassle of finding available and working chargers and having to sit around for a bit waiting.
 




Hugo Rune

Hugo Rune

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Feb 23, 2012
23,362
Brighton
Bozza said:
Sounds similar to me - long drives are very few and far between these days.

When my old Civic finally gives up the ghost, I do wonder if a hybrid would be the best option.

50-100 mile battery range would cover 95%+ of my driving, enabling me to charge for pennies at home as and when.

For longer drives, it seems that the chargers, certainly the quick ones, cost about the same as petrol so why not just use petrol and do away with the hassle of finding available and working chargers and having to sit around for a bit waiting.
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I did think about a hybrid option. Infact, it was my preferred option for some time but I’ve shifted my thinking based on the following:

1. Eco pressure from the rest of the family. My kids know exactly what is coming out of the exhaust pipes from my current petrol motor.

2. Cost: I’ll be looking at the used market, the big hybrid’s I fancy are out of my budget. However, the market does seem good for large electric vehicles.

3. Charging: I work from the office most days, there are plenty of chargers at work for me to hook up to. In addition, my drive is well positioned alongside my house meaning a home installation of a charging unit would be straight forward. I’ve seen deals where you get a year of charging free with some energy suppliers or a free charger with some car dealerships.

4. Size: I need a big boot for the dog and baggage when we go away. Hybrids often stick their batteries in the boot which is a bit annoying.

However, I’m not taking the dive until November at the earliest so plenty of time for things to change.
 


Flounce

Flounce

Well-known member
Nov 15, 2006
3,456
Greg Bobkin said:
Not when the Renault 5 (on which the Alpine is based) arrives before it...
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Don’t underestimate the sporting heritage of the Dieppe based Alpine. I will be shocked if it’s not much more of a driver’s car than the Renault
 


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